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Discussion Starter #1
Posting in this section because you are the suspension know-it-alls.

Have the AOD out doing a wide ratio build...the opportunity to upgrade other stuff while the car is elevated got me into the rear main seal, oil pump/pan gasket project, aluminum rack bushings that I've had for a year, ES motor mounts, tranny mount & crossmember bushings, aluminum driveshaft, etc.
I'm looking at the rear upper control arms that weren't touched when I did my MM lower control arms, Quad shocks, and Bilstein's. At the time I had intended to do the OE type control arms that maximum motor sports was selling...but they have been unavailable for years now.

So I see that I have some options, keeping in mind that I don't have any major issues that I can blame on the UCA's.

1) forget about it and finish my current project.

2) replace the axle end bushings only.

3) replace both ends of UCA bushings (Moog or AC Delco).

4) add just the MM panhard bar knowing I can do their TA option later and remove the UCA's.

5) panhard bar and TA at the same time at close to $800 and be done with it. Looks like my 3.73's and wide ratio gearing may dictate the heavy duty TA (?).

Yes I drive the car hard on the twisties but not a track car. Are these upgrades worthy of the $? The cost would not kill me right now.
 

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Almost anything is better than the stock quadrabind EXCEPT upper control arms with stiffer bushings. So, whatever you do, don't do that.

Slightly cheaper option to the PHB/Torque arm is a PM3L. If you already have a panhard bar and don't want to shell out yet for a TA, it's about half the cost of the MM standard duty TA. Use rod-ended UCA with a spherical bearing in the ear. You'll also need to increase your rear spring rate just like you would with a TA. Your front rates and goals for the car will determine the best rear rate to pair with your shocks. If you search my username, you'll fine more detailed posts on the subject.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
My springs (eibach prokit), shocks/struts (Bilstein HD), LCA's (MM non adj), are pretty much new. I guess I would tend to lean towards what makes an improvement without re-purchasing those items. I know the lower rubber bushings are pretty easy with that tool...but is the chassis end rubber bushing nearly impossible? Maybe the PHB & TA would be a wasted effort on this car.

Come to think of it...what I really have now is this Maximum Motorsports Road & Track package:

1990-93 Mustang Road & Track Box includes

MM Road & Track Springs (430C0)
*MM Caster/Camber Plates (MMCC9093) (select Black or Chrome finish option)
*Bilstein struts (V36-4138-H5)
*Bilstein shocks (B46-2148-H1)
*Front and rear Urethane Spring Isolators
*Urethane Pinion Snubber (MMPS) (solid axle Mustangs)
*MM XL Series Full-length Subframe Connectors (MMFL-5B)
*MM Strut Tower Brace (MMSTB-1)
*MM 4-Point K-Member Brace (MMKB4-2)
?MM Panhard Bar with Aluminum Rod (MMPBA)
*MM Heavy-duty Rear Lower Control Arms (MMRLCA-1)
?MM Solid Steering Shaft (MMST-11)
*MM Solid Steering rack Bushings (MMST-7)
*Front Swaybar bushings
*Front Swaybar end links
?Front control arm bushings, urethane (6-205-BL)

With the exception of not having the panhard bar & the solid steering shaft. AND substitute the Eibach ProKit springs. Everything else I have on the car already...So maybe I should add the panhard bar next?
 

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I have a similar set-up under mine. The PHB made a HUGE difference.
When I first put the car together, I was offered a set of generic U/L control arms with urethane at all points. THAT s**t lasted for about a month. I went with SN95 uppers, MM lowers, and the PHB. I am currently looking for a single Heim joint adjustable upper to go PM3L.

Bang for the buck with what you have now: PHB.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I have a similar set-up under mine. The PHB made a HUGE difference.
When I first put the car together, I was offered a set of generic U/L control arms with urethane at all points. THAT s**t lasted for about a month. I went with SN95 uppers, MM lowers, and the PHB. I am currently looking for a single Heim joint adjustable upper to go PM3L.

Bang for the buck with what you have now: PHB.
Appreciate the input...I will not stop there, but it's nice to be able to at least work towards a proven package...I just don't know if MM's spring rates are somewhat similar or if that even matters. I'll have to seek out info on the SN95 uppers.
Since the phb install doesn't require the trans/driveshaft/exhaust to be removed I'll just carry on with the current project...just in case I have some cost overruns with the tranny.
Thanks...
 

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I have a similar set-up under mine. The PHB made a HUGE difference.
When I first put the car together, I was offered a set of generic U/L control arms with urethane at all points. THAT s**t lasted for about a month. I went with SN95 uppers, MM lowers, and the PHB. I am currently looking for a single Heim joint adjustable upper to go PM3L.

Bang for the buck with what you have now: PHB.
Trzmotorsports.com for the upper control arm and solid bushing
 

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Welcome. I'm personally running them and have been very happy. Been through a few track days and an entire autocross season and not a single problem. No play nothing awkward
 

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Pretty sure those are what I have as well. They will sell the UCA and spherical bearing individually. Was turned on to them by a buddy of mine who races CMC in Texas. Haven't had any problems and I abuse the #### out of my car (auto-x'ing on 16*12s with Hoosier bias ply tires last year, and 18*10s with 285s and 305s road racing slicks before that).
 

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This is in regards to my drift build, but the same idea carries over. I emailed maximum motorsports about the same thing.

me: "Lastly, I replaced my uppers with some misc aftermarket arms, but this year went back to stock. They have 27 year old bushings in
them and as you can imagine, are very sloppy. What would you recommend to replace them with? I have tossed around the idea of just
going to a torque arm setup, but after some research, I believe it will actually give me to much grip for the power level I am at
with a basic heads/cam/intake 306."

Jack Hidley "Steeda sells a UCA with a three piece polyurethane bushing in the chassis end. I would probably use that. A stock UCA even with new
rubber bushings is not going to control wheel hop very well in your situation.

A Torque Arm could be used at your power level. To adjust the handling balance, you would need to install a much larger rear swaybar
and stiffer rear springs."
 

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Discussion Starter #11
So...because I have a learning disability ? The Steeda UCA' s on their site are now the "go to" replacement UCA for my situation even before panhard bar? Will the steel non adjustable, aluminum non-adjustable, or aluminum adjustable UCA's be the best fit? Steel non adjustable UCA's are $100 less but a non issue to me. Is the the panhard bar highly recommended still to complete the deal?
 

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Do the PHB.
I have stock SN95 UCA's on my car with freshly installed axle-end bushings and MM lowers. I rebuilt the diff last summer and took the bar off to get it out of the way. Got done and dropped the car off the hoist. I figured I would just pop around the block to see if the noise from the driveline was gone. The handling was different. It was not as bad as when I had the all-urethane bushed arms, but was NOT as planted. Pulled it back in the shop, put the bar back on, and took it out to make sure the car was back. It was.

The control arms will make a difference. Not as much as the PHB.
 

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To clarify post #10. I recommended the Steeda part in this case because the car is used for drifting. In some cases, drifting and drag racing, this works better than using stock rubber bushings in both ends. However this is the exception, not the rule.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
To clarify post #10. I recommended the Steeda part in this case because the car is used for drifting. In some cases, drifting and drag racing, this works better than using stock rubber bushings in both ends. However this is the exception, not the rule.
I see the Panhard bar installation may need a 1/4" wheel spacer as my 9" wheels are pretty close to the stated >5.75" back spacing (Mine are listed at 5.71")...which I would imagine requires longer studs...Also, Does it make sense doing a PH bar while I still have 4 Lug/Drum brakes (don't laugh :))? Not a track car but like to be able to drive it hard...Is this silly to consider before going to 5 lug all disc brakes, etc.?
 

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To determine if your existing wheel studs can work with a 0.25" wheel spacer, go to the MM website and download the 0.25" wheel spacer installation instructions and read through them. They explain how to test for this.

The PHB is one of those few parts that makes a significant difference in the handling and feel of the car all the time, even at low cornering forces. There is virtually no added NVH, so it is a win-win.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
To determine if your existing wheel studs can work with a 0.25" wheel spacer, go to the MM website and download the 0.25" wheel spacer installation instructions and read through them. They explain how to test for this.
Nothing's ever easy :) 10.5 full turns (need 11 turns to meet the criteria). That's IF I need the spacers...would that be close enough?
 

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I don't think that there would be any problem with that. The first three threads have 90% of the load on them. The first six threads have 100% of the load on them. The rest are along for the ride.

See the load distribution image on page 8 of the document linked below.

http://fp.optics.arizona.edu/optomech/Fall14/Notes/18 Fasteners.pdf

If there is a thread failure, it will occur while you are torquing the nut, not when driving.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I don't think that there would be any problem with that. The first three threads have 90% of the load on them. The first six threads have 100% of the load on them. The rest are along for the ride.

See the load distribution image on page 8 of the document linked below.

http://fp.optics.arizona.edu/optomech/Fall14/Notes/18 Fasteners.pdf

If there is a thread failure, it will occur while you are torquing the nut, not when driving.
Great info! Thanks. I may do @ least 1/8" to 3/16" spacers all the way around as that may also solve my full crank left turn, strut-meets-wheel contact I've been avoiding.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Just ordered the Panhard Bar from LMR for a good price (w/ a $25 coupon)...when reading through the specs on the Maximum Motorsports site there is a specific reference to a T/A diff cover (fitting) but further recommendation of a lower profile cover...not sure if that affects me. I have finned design Ford Racing differential shown here->



I hope I don't need to buy (another) new one. What dimensional depth restriction am I facing?
 

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My cover is 3" tall(generic ultra low profile TA cover) and clears no problem. The sway bar is closer than the panhard.
 
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