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Discussion Starter #1
I have a 93 coupe with sn brakes and some suspension mods - ill probably go with an MM box.. I go to one hpde a year but I enjoy a handling car on the street. The extra power is fun on the street too. I have the option right now to install a dart 331 w/ s-trim or possibly get a 2011 5.0 motor.

I was wondering if any of you have any success using a higher hp centrifugal setup on the road course?

Jeff
 

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People have had great success with it, but it brings a whole other dimension of cooling, packaging, complication, and failure points with it.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I guess I realized that.. I'm just trying to decide what combo to pick :).
 

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My S-Trim 302 has been a blast during HPDE. As MFE stated it just adds another thing that can break. I pay close attention to my maintanance to ensure reliability.
A blown 331 can be a handful especially if ones car has limited brake and suspension upgrades.

Out of the 2 motor choices, I would choose the dart for the ease of the install.
 

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My car has 310rwhp. I'm very happy with it. I only wish it was a 10:1 compression motor instead of 8.5:1. It could use a little more midrange power
 

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You could start with a 9.0:1 331 motor and just stay N/A...in the future, you could always throw on the s-trim once the car (and you) are capable of using the extra hp.
 

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To me, the ideal motor would certainly be N/A and have a good RPM range and not something under alot of stress. I'm thinking something like 10:1 compression and either that 331 or more preferably a 347.

350-375hp(with aluminum) in a Fox that CAN GRIP would be a great car.
 

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The cool factor and day-to-day livability of the 2011 5.0L would be awesome, the installation of said motor, not as much.

Of course a supercharged OHV motor could be pretty livable too if the cam and exhaust setup isn't super aggressive, problem there really is cooling. Lots of laps at RPM are going to wreck havoc on the temp of a supercharged engine and you'll need to do some figuring (or more likely trial and error- during costly track days) for cooling the water and the incoming air charge.

Either setup will have it's plus' and minus'.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
400 na HP from an OE motor like that new 2011 sure is tempting.

I know this goes slightly against the "Mustang" guy thinking but as I've gotten older, I've really started liking the higher-reving imports like Posche, Ferrari... It's pretty attractive to me to make my musclecar a little more "exotic" with the DOHC NA power and likely the MM grip box.

Here's what I'm working with.
http://gallery.me.com/jefffoster#100102&bgcolor=black&view=grid
 

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"I was wondering if any of you have any success using a higher hp centrifugal setup on the road course?"


sadly, no. my vorteched 302 didn't hold up to the punishment. but, i drove the piss out of my car during 6-10 track days a year. one track day a year hardly qualifies it as severe duty. i wouldn't sweat it.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
^^ and a clutch fan? :) :) How many of those have you been through? My car has 33k miles - so the fan is perfect but I wasn't anticipating using it for my combo...just didn't think they held up.
 

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Old photo, while engine was being assembled.
I dont have ANY fan on there [no clutch, no electric, none]. As long as I am moving its okay. Concerned a bit during long pit waiting, but ontrack no concerns.
 

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To me, the ideal motor would certainly be N/A and have a good RPM range and not something under alot of stress. I'm thinking something like 10:1 compression and either that 331 or more preferably a 347.

350-375hp(with aluminum) in a Fox that CAN GRIP would be a great car.
I would reverse the statement of 331 vs 347. 347 is going to have the wrist pin higher on the piston and this leaves a weak point on the ring landings. Where the 331 wrist pin will be lower and give more meat to the ring landings. For a motor that is run hard and possibly with a blower this is something to consider.

Patrick
 

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^^ and a clutch fan? :) :) How many of those have you been through? My car has 33k miles - so the fan is perfect but I wasn't anticipating using it for my combo...just didn't think they held up.
I've traded off between the clutch fan with no shroud and a Flex-a-lite black magic and I'll be honest, with the clutch fan (as far as I know it has 160k on it) the car stays cooler.

I'm planning to move to a Mark VIII, Taurus, or Contour fan but haven't gotten around to it.
 

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For a motor that is run hard and possibly with a blower this is something to consider.

Patrick
Right, but that's why I stated "it would certainly be N/A and not under alot of stress". ;)

Darius makes the blower motor work great, but with my luck i'd need it as simplistic as possible.
 

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Although the engine isn't in my handling car, my 9:1 compression dart 331ci makes awesome power across a wide RPM range and I know it'd be a monster on a road course. I built the shortblock to be the foundation for the T76 PTK single turbo setup I have, the car runs so well NA though that it's been 3yrs now and I still haven't had enough desire to put the turbo on. The car is dead nuts reliable, it doesn't surge, it doesn't buck, it just pulls from any and all RPM's. The basics are:

-RNH built dart sportsman block 9:1 331
-Scat 4340 forged crank and H beam rods with ARP 2000 rod bolts
-SRP forged pistons
-internally balanced
-AFR 185 comp heads with their upgraded valve springs
-probe shaft mount rockers
-FTI cam from my old 302 NA combo
-Holley systemax II intake ported by TMOSS
-MAC 1-3/4 long tubes
-Dr. Gas 3" into 2.5" X pipe
-2.5" cat back with dynomax welded ultraflow mufflers

I run and tune it myself with an AEM stand alone. Here's my latest dyno graph made on a HORRIBLE weather day:




If built right, the 331 can perform very well NA, and if you have a dart you can go 363 or more with a >4.125" bore and a 3.5" stroke. It "should" be more reliable and simpler to maintain than a blown setup over the long haul as well.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I already have the 331 and it sounds exactly like yours :). RNH built mine as well. I have different rockers but the same heads and internals...intake too.
I think the cam I have might be somewhat blower specific but maybe it will work. Hmm.. Maybe I'll go na initially then add the blower... Or maybe I'll just switch to na for track events :)
 

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Discussion Starter #20
This should look familiar :)


331ci Stroker, 4.03” DART Sportsman 8.20" deck
CRANK Eagle Internal Balance 4340 3.25” STROKE X 2.10/.927 PIN
5.400 ROD X 2.249 MAIN
RODS Eagle 4340 3D H-BEAM ARP 2000 Rod Bolt Upgrade
PISTONS PROBE SRS Series 14.2cc dish
PT# 12352-030 JOB#
CH 1.175 PIN .927”
WRIST PINS Probe Steel.927” Diameter, Dual Spiral Locks
MAIN Clevite 77 MS-590H
ROD CLEVITE 77 PT# CB-1227-H in ROD and CAP(BEARING MADE FOR LARGE FILLET EDGE CRANK)
RINGS PERFECT CIRCLE PT# 315-0049.005
4.03” 1/16 1/16 3/16 8CYL
JE RAIL SUPPORTS
BALANCE 0.OZ Pioneer Steel Hub, SFI Approved, Latemodel
BLOCK DART Sportsman (Align honed, decked, squared, blueprinted, bored and finish honed with TQ plates, lifter bores honed, brass freeze plugs, coated cam bearings) Modified/Massaged oil passages for better internal flow and draining.
CAM Flowtech Induction Custom Hyd Roller
SC-13F14S-HR12 +4*
.568/.576 218/228 112
(Cam was within 1 degree when it was degreed to motor)
Billet Timing Set
Ford Racing Hyd Roller Lifters, .001” clearance
Ford Racing Billet Cam Retainer Plate
DART Coated Cam Bearings
Canton 7qt Deep Sump Pan, Canton Pick-up, Canton Dip Stick, Melling 10688 HP Pump, adj spring + 25% volume , Ford Racing Chrome-moly oil drive shaft shaft. Fel-Pro 1 pc Oil Pan Gasket OS-30616R
CYLINDER HEADS AFR 185 PT#1388, Supplied by FTI with a PS3 upgrade (springs and seals)
ARP ½” head studs 154-4201
INDUCTION Holley SysteMAX II
Fel-Pro 1262
Scorpion Stud Mount 1.72” Rockers
TFS Pushrods , 1 piece chrome-moly 5/16” Diameter 6.20” L (Same length as supplied by FTI)
Ford Racing Chrom Valve Covers
New Ford timing cover
Chrome waterpump
 
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