Ford Mustang Forums banner

1 - 20 of 26 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
756 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I'm trying to figure out the cheapest way for my TT set up for next year. I have 3 1968 302 Blocks, I would really like to have the New Boss Block or a Dart, but money is the issue. I have seen alot of people making insane HP and Torque using production blocks with the Hard Block cement, Steel Main Girdle and a Valley Girdle. Right now I don't know which way to go. I know production blocks have their limits, but this will be in a weekend car that see's the street very little and mostly an 1/8 mile car and few qtr mile passes every now and they. For those of you have had any experience with Hard Block let me know what you have seen and the pro's and con's of it would be.

Rusty:idunno:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
430 Posts
I have only used the block fill in 351c blocks. They are famous for thin cylinder walls. My car is a track only car with program enginering 4 bolt billet main caps. it allows me to run a .060 everbore . you could never do that with out it. Basically it allows me a .030, .040.and an .060 overbore on the same block, four bolt blocks being somewhat scarce these days. I make about 750hp NA . run methanol. have run it on gas and living in sw florida it gets plenty hot. on gas i've seen water temps as high as 240. on methanol they stay around 180-190. seeems to hold oil temp better once I get it warmed up. your biggest problem is really in splitting the main webs and i don't think the filler will help you there. I don't see where the girdle will help much. i think they are more for cap walk. If your going to spend a bunch of money on heads and turbos etc, I would try and find a pre 72 block or go with a aftermarket block. jmo good luck
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
756 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Thanks for the helpful info and the reply, I have 3 1968 302 blocks in good condition. I'm wondering how they will hold up with a "Short Fill" in the water jackets, steel girdle machined caps and the valley girdle? This is pretty much a weeked car and limted track time as well in the local 1/8th mile.

Rusty
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
446 Posts
I have a .040 over 69 351W block hard blocked half way up. It gets a little warm in traffic when it's 90 degrees +. I drove the car to a cruise in today about 10-15 miles from my house and the temp was right at 205. my engine it 12.3.1 comp. and runs 10.60 @ 129 "On Motor so far, Haven't sprayed it yet" so it's not completly mild. I have a summit radiator, a csr electric water pump and a mark VIII fan.

Hope this helps
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
446 Posts
oh yeah I also have a trans cooler than I have -10an lines ran to with a oil filter relocation kit. I use this as an engine oil cooler with a small fan in front of the radiator. works pretty well
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,734 Posts
I have my 71 Mexican(302) block 1/2 filled with a main studs, Girdle and Billet main caps. I don't have overheating issues but my car is a track only car( No street duty) and i run an electric waterpump.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
756 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
So by using the hard block, main girdle, valley girdle and main studs I "might" be ok as far as the block holding up. Should I go with billet mani caps as well? Thanks for the helpful info and the replies.

Rusty
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
756 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
You could probably sell those vintage blocks and have almost enough for a good aftermarket block.
Yeah that is true, I haven't thought about that, I might as well go a head a carry all of them to the machine shop and have them hot tanked, magna fluxed etc. I might as well do that I have 7 302 blocks all together.

Rusty
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
756 Posts
Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
All I need to finish is the exhaust from the turbos back to the off road x pipe. I should be finished with the manual brake conversion today. I got the upper and lower intakes on finally. I paln on staying with TT's for a long time to come. How is yours coing along?

Rusty
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
536 Posts
I thought I saw someone selling a boss 302(original) around here for $400 or $500. Do a search.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17,637 Posts
there is no problem filling the early stock blocks to halfway up or even a little further up.

the "valley girdle" is useless and a piece of QUAP....

also, in an EARLY BLOCK, there is no need for a main girdle, just have a machinist "bottom tap" the threads in block and check overall thread engagement on a set of ARP main studs, and then do a proper "line hone" of the main saddles,...for proper bearing seating and fit,.....
.usually, when any block filler is used, the bores do in fact get "squeezed" a bit, and so a proper and EXACT rigid hone ( sunnen method) is needed or else you can in fact have a tight piston and it will sieze up when ran hard....

when having poured in the powder, you hasve to wait three or four days to allow it to harden properly,...
and then hone, etc...

but then you must WASH it very, very well, and clean out all the oil passages and such otherewize there will be a catastrophy in your oil system later...!!!!!

read the directions that come in the box of block filler powder... they tell of these things and other stuff in detail....

and that is about it....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,990 Posts
.usually, when any block filler is used, the bores do in fact get "squeezed" a bit, and so a proper and EXACT rigid hone ( sunnen method) is needed or else you can in fact have a tight piston and it will sieze up when ran hard....

when having poured in the powder, you hasve to wait three or four days to allow it to harden properly,...
and then hone, etc...
Actually it's best to do all boring and honing after the filler has completely cured or it'll end up like mine did. Mine got bored, poured and then honed. When I honed it, there were high and low spots that I know were not there after the boring.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
536 Posts
Actually it's best to do all boring and honing after the filler has completely cured or it'll end up like mine did. Mine got bored, poured and then honed. When I honed it, there were high and low spots that I know were not there after the boring.
So what did you do?

I am in a similar position as you were. My block('69 351w) has been bored already and I was wanting to add the block filler and then have it finish honed.

I would like to make 650 rwhp, max rpm around 6700, with a Precision 76gts.

Jess
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,990 Posts
So what did you do?

I am in a similar position as you were. My block('69 351w) has been bored already and I was wanting to add the block filler and then have it finish honed.

I would like to make 650 rwhp, max rpm around 6700, with a Precision 76gts.
I honed it and ran it like that. I had mine bored very close so I wouldn't have to hone it much. It takes a longer than you would think to hone .001'' out of each cyl so I didn't want that to take any longer than necessary. The guy ended up boring it about exactly on the clearance I wanted to end up with so that didn't leave much room for honing. Had that not been the case, I would have honed the spots out. If your bore is .002'' smaller than what you want to end up with, go ahead and fill it, let it cure as per the instructions, run a precision hone in it briefly and see what it looks like. If you have the high and low spots like I had, you should be able to hone them out if you started at least .002'' smaller than what you wanted to end up with. If the bore is closer than .002'' smaller than the desired end result, there is a high chance you'll end up with a bore that didn't clear up everywhere like mine. I run about .008'' clearance in my motor and it uses a little oil all along but it is a high rpm race only motor so that's no big deal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17,637 Posts
use a deck torque plate also...

they cant accurately hone the bores without the actual piston "in hand"

the pistons vary in actual size, and as A...C... has pointed out, proper rigid hone ( sunnen method) NOT a HBALL BRUSH hone is the ONLY way to get a proper finish and to remove the high spots after a cement filler is added.


also, if YOU are the one that is mixing and pouring and such, then you better tape / block off the head bolt threads...it is really / REALLY hard to get the cement out of the threads...!!!!!

and after it all dries for a few days,
it is also best to purposely have a water hose flushing and you using a hard ./ stiff brush to remove any and all loose particles of the cement that may be on top of the pour because that cement is going to RUIN the hone guys machines oil pump, or if a piece breaks off and happens to fall into the hone area while the hone head is in the cylinder, the cement will gouge out the bore, .....could even break the stone..

he will get mad....!!!!!
 
1 - 20 of 26 Posts
Top