Thoughts on 5 speed plus 2 step - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:00 PM Thread Starter
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Thoughts on 5 speed plus 2 step

Say I've got a 5 speed manual transmission and a 2 step rev limiter. The limiter is set at 4,000 rpm with the clutch pedal down and 6,000 rpm with it released. If I powershift all the way down the track, wouldn't the limiter keep the rpms at 4k until the clutch pedal came back up, effectively keeping me in boost with the throttle blade open all the way down the track?

Discuss. I'm sure this has been thought of before but I don't know a ton about these systems. I'm looking for a way to improve track times without adding boost or engine parts, and keep the car around 420 whp.


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post #2 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:07 PM
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Every two step I have seen was hooked up via some switch activated/deactivated via the driver's hand.


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post #3 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:10 PM Thread Starter
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Right, but if you have it activated via the clutch switch, then every time the clutch goes down the 2 step goes on. If it would work the way I think it would I might just try it once I get a beefed up trans.

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post #4 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:13 PM
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Why would you want to do that and risk engaging the two step during any WOT shift? I am sure if you got fancy with the wiring you could have it so that some safety switch would enable it to work via the clutch but once the clutch is lifted up on the safety switch would need to be flipped again so that the 2-step would start the next time the peddle is pushed in. That would in turn avoid the possibility of it engage during shifts.

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post #5 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:17 PM Thread Starter
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That's the point, to engage it during a shift. The way I see it, it would help drop the RPM down so you're not screwing up the tranny, and it would help keep boost up. Again, I really don't know much about this and that's why I'm asking. Would it work, and would it cause any damage?

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post #6 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:19 PM
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I do not think the rev limiter will be able to even kick in quick enough to do anything. Well unless the car was really slow then maybe. Try downshifting to the wrong gear sometime and see just how well a rev limiter does not keep the motor from over revving. If you are that worried about the transmission lasting then just do not powershift the thing.

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post #7 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:24 PM Thread Starter
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Well when you downshift to the wrong gear it's the speed of the car that's spinning the motor up, not the gas pedal. The point of a rev limiter is so that you can't spin the motor too high under throttle, and it works great. Anyways, I just figured that dumping a little extra gas down the pipes between shifts would help keep the boost up and give better track times, because the turbos would stay spooled the entire run.

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post #8 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:25 PM
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Megasquirt has that function separate from the 2-step called "flat-shift". It works...sometimes too well, to the point that it's notorious for melting valves without the proper settings....from the extreme heat associated with retarding/cutting timing @ 6000 RPM!

It's actually fairly commonly used with rally cars...although they have more or less perfected it. Have you ever seen the crazy flames they shoot out of the pipes between shifts? That's the flat-shift system hard at work.

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post #9 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:26 PM
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I believe AEM has that as well, probably a few others.

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post #10 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:26 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millhouse View Post
Megasquirt has that function separate from the 2-step called "anti-lag". It works...sometimes too well, to the point that it's notorious for melting valves from the extreme heat associated with retarding timing @ 6000 RPM!

It's actually fairly commonly used with rally cars...although they have more or less perfected it. Have you ever seen the crazy flames they shoot out of the pipes between shifts? That's the anti-lag system hard at work.
That's what I'm talking about. I've never seen it, but it would definitely help stick cars make it down the track faster.


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post #11 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:51 PM
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That's what I'm talking about. I've never seen it, but it would definitely help stick cars make it down the track faster.
Sorry, it's "flat shift" not anti-lag. Anti-lag is megasquirt lingo for 2-step.
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post #12 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 02:55 PM Thread Starter
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Whatever it's called, I'll have to either do a two step and see if I can work with that or MS my car sometime this year, I hate losing boost between shifts.

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post #13 of 26 Old 06-05-2009, 03:07 PM
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i have a 2 step for my car but haven't wired it up yet. my plan was to wire it to a toggle switch to arm it, then to the clutch switch, then to a micro switch like found on a nitrous kit. i was gonna make a bracket to bolt on to one of the 4 shifter hold down bolts and then bend the bracket around untill the micro switch only lined up with first gear. this way the 2 step could only be activated if the toggle switch was on, the clutch pedal was down and the car was in first gear.

i haven't tried it yet but thought it might work lol

just thought i'd mention the idea.
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post #14 of 26 Old 06-12-2009, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonlx View Post
i have a 2 step for my car but haven't wired it up yet. my plan was to wire it to a toggle switch to arm it, then to the clutch switch, then to a micro switch like found on a nitrous kit. i was gonna make a bracket to bolt on to one of the 4 shifter hold down bolts and then bend the bracket around untill the micro switch only lined up with first gear. this way the 2 step could only be activated if the toggle switch was on, the clutch pedal was down and the car was in first gear.

i haven't tried it yet but thought it might work lol

just thought i'd mention the idea.
I planned on doing the same thing.

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post #15 of 26 Old 06-12-2009, 03:32 PM
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There is a pretty good discussion going on about this exact topic in the general forum.. search is your friend

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post #16 of 26 Old 06-12-2009, 07:31 PM Thread Starter
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Actually, this is a different topic, so I made a different thread. Thanks for your input though.

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post #17 of 26 Old 06-12-2009, 07:34 PM
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oh really, guess your retarded then.

That post shows exactly how to wire a relay so it doesnt trigger everytime you press the clutch pedal

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post #18 of 26 Old 06-12-2009, 07:41 PM
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oh really, guess your retarded then.

That post shows exactly how to wire a relay so it doesnt trigger everytime you press the clutch pedal
He wants it to trigger every time, wants to build a poor man's anti-lag setup.

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post #19 of 26 Old 06-12-2009, 07:42 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich Gill View Post
oh really, guess your retarded then.

That post shows exactly how to wire a relay so it doesnt trigger everytime you press the clutch pedal
That's not what I asked, I was curious as to what would happen if the two step did trigger every time the cluch was depressed.

Edit: Who's retarded?

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post #20 of 26 Old 06-12-2009, 09:27 PM
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Rich, I think he's trying to keep the throtle floored between (power shifting)
shifts so no boost is lost.


Personally, I think us turbo guys running 5 speeds is a waste . I'm gona try this custom clutch I ordered but thinking seriously about going auto.

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post #21 of 26 Old 06-13-2009, 10:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jman511115 View Post
I'm looking for a way to improve track times without adding boost or engine parts, and keep the car around 420 whp.
Im around 420hp and can tell ya this is a waste.. risk vs reward !! I launch with full boost of the 2step and the car pretty much holds it. it MIGHT drop more then I think but its hard to watch a boost gauge on the 1-2 shift lauching with 10 psi on slicks lol I feel NO loss of boost at all..

I rather up the boost then "try" something that is notorious for hurting parts.

maybe you just need to learn to shift faster lol lol dont get all bent its a joke lol

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post #22 of 26 Old 06-13-2009, 07:01 PM Thread Starter
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Im around 420hp and can tell ya this is a waste.. risk vs reward !! I launch with full boost of the 2step and the car pretty much holds it. it MIGHT drop more then I think but its hard to watch a boost gauge on the 1-2 shift lauching with 10 psi on slicks lol I feel NO loss of boost at all..

I rather up the boost then "try" something that is notorious for hurting parts.

maybe you just need to learn to shift faster lol lol dont get all bent its a joke lol
I don't want to up the boost because I'm on the stock block and I want to see how fast I can go with 420. Just gotta beef up the trans to hold the powershifts.

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post #23 of 26 Old 06-13-2009, 09:18 PM
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How fast are you running ^

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post #24 of 26 Old 06-13-2009, 09:26 PM Thread Starter
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11's

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post #25 of 26 Old 06-13-2009, 10:56 PM
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11's
could ya be more vague?? high 11s mid 11s low 11s ?? 110mph 130 mph 240 mph? lol lol 1.6 60 foots or 2.3s? lol

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post #26 of 26 Old 06-13-2009, 11:14 PM
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Trying to keep boost might be as easy for you as tightening up the BOV so it doesn't open so easy with little vacuum....

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