Spring rates in the KONI "Sport Kit"? - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
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post #1 of 38 Old 01-02-2006, 09:43 PM Thread Starter
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Spring rates in the KONI "Sport Kit"?

http://www.ltbmotorsports.com/kospsukit.html

Anyone know what the rates are on those springs? I probably could call, but didn't know if anyone had researched for themselves and gotten an answer.

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post #2 of 38 Old 01-03-2006, 12:36 AM
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I tried to find out but was basically told, "We don't give out that information because then others could copy us."


'89 GT convertible, N/A 357W, MM front susp w/425# coil-overs and Koni D/As, MM TA/PB rear setup (Koni Yellows, 390-430# springs), Stoptech 332mm / 12" Baers, MM 6 point rollbar, Maier 1.5" flared fenders & quarters, 18x9.5" front/18x10.5" rear Enkei RPF-1s (street), 18x10" CCW C-10s (track), etc...
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post #3 of 38 Old 01-03-2006, 04:46 AM Thread Starter
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I've heard of that happening. Must be Eibach springs, I hear they are pretty stingy. O well.....
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post #4 of 38 Old 01-03-2006, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Olsen
I tried to find out but was basically told, "We don't give out that information because then others could copy us."
+1.

-Bill

96 F350 PSD
Sold: 97 Cobra
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post #5 of 38 Old 01-03-2006, 11:17 AM Thread Starter
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Well, I'm thinking I may give these a shot. I think the price is decent for Koni singles(WITH SPRINGS)with a somewhat matched spring. Surely the singles can handle upto 600 rate front spring.

I'll give the place a call and ask myself.....worth a shot. I may lean towards that Bilstein package on the same website. Similiar price, and deep down I really don't wanna go through the test-n-tune of an adjustable shock again.

Last edited by 2k2GT; 01-03-2006 at 11:20 AM.
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post #6 of 38 Old 01-03-2006, 07:57 PM
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We sell the Koni Kits and they are not forthcoming on the rates to dealers..

DaveW
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post #7 of 38 Old 01-03-2006, 08:02 PM Thread Starter
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Geeez....Can you beat their price, Dave?
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post #8 of 38 Old 01-04-2006, 09:40 AM
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I would possibly buy the kit if I knew what the rates were.

-Bill

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Sold: 97 Cobra
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post #9 of 38 Old 01-04-2006, 09:48 AM
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Bill,

Don't hold your breath. The official line that I've gotten is that thier spring rates are a certain percentage higher than stock, and lower the car a certain amount (depends on the car) and that's all you need to know.

It sucks, but thier market for these kits is someone who just wants a small performance and looks improvement, and doesn't care about or isn't qualified to know the spring rates. It is a "matched package" and that is it's draw.

Kind of a bummer, but the kits do sell well, so maybe they are on to something.

HTH,

DaveW
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post #10 of 38 Old 01-05-2006, 08:08 AM
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Or it could just be that there's a sucker born every minute.

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post #11 of 38 Old 01-05-2006, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Or it could just be that there's a sucker born every minute.
Possibly.

Actually, IMO, there is a pretty large population of people who aren't familiar or comfortable with selecting matched spring rates, and won't/can't spend the time researching all the combinations, so they may be better off juts buying a package to get them started.

Just IMO,
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post #12 of 38 Old 01-05-2006, 11:37 AM
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It's not like any of us are asking for the specific material information, wire diameter, coil diameter, and active coil count that they used to get to whatever rate. Even for a little after the fact trimming, it's still not necessary to know all of that (even though at that point one could make all of the necessary measurements).

As far as the notion of "matched package" goes, if they don't describe what their basis for calling it "matched" happens to be, even that is not tremendously useful information (matched for what? best ride at 35 mph? best ride at 85 mph? autocross? drifting? car fully loaded? driver only?)

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Mine: '08 GT, 5MT, black/light graphite, un-Fstock (DD, occasional track day)
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post #13 of 38 Old 01-05-2006, 11:40 AM
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Did you guys call Koni directly? Lee Grimes was very helpful when I called with a Honda question.

A few years ago, I had no luck getting rates for my Volkswagen at H&R, but I didn't know of anyone to specifically ask for.

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post #14 of 38 Old 01-05-2006, 04:07 PM
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That link also has a generic picture so the set may or may not be coil overs. Are you looking to go coil overs or regular?
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post #15 of 38 Old 01-05-2006, 05:35 PM Thread Starter
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just standard replacement springs/shocks/struts. Coilovers=$$$$$$
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post #16 of 38 Old 01-05-2006, 08:40 PM
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I bet those won't be much if any stiffer than the Eibachs you are running now.
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post #17 of 38 Old 01-05-2006, 09:17 PM Thread Starter
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Re-thinking.......i've talked to a couple others who seemed to brag on the "ride quality" versus the performance gain. "C" springs seem cheap, have a stiff rate, and may just get some Bilsteins's like I orginally planned.
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post #18 of 38 Old 01-05-2006, 09:19 PM
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I've been real happy with my Tokico Illuminas and C springs. The 5 position adjustments with marked and detented settings make them very easy to tune for different surfaces. Read what Tokico has to say here. http://www.tokicogasshocks.com/car/mustang.html

The ILK238 is a kit with Illumina shocks and struts and 1.5" lowering springs. I found it for $573.31 with free shipping here. http://www.performancepeddler.com/de...T_ID=TOKILK238 They also have a "email best offer" link that would be worth a try.

You could try calling Tokico at 800-548-2549 and see if they will give you the spring rates. They seem to have spent a fair amount of testing with Mustangs.
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post #19 of 38 Old 01-06-2006, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k2GT
Re-thinking.......i've talked to a couple others who seemed to brag on the "ride quality" versus the performance gain. "C" springs seem cheap, have a stiff rate, and may just get some Bilsteins's like I orginally planned.
Tony,
I haven't run the Tokico Illuminas, as Han Solo suggested, so I can't comment on them. However, I have run and still run Bilsteins on my 95 Cobra and I have one thing to say, AWESOME DAMPERS! They improve the ride tremendously over the stock stuff and use progressive valving that handles high rate springs without a problem. I used them with a set of FMS B springs, then a set of H&R Race springs and now with front coil overs. For a daily driver/autocross car they are excellent and work extremely well with the H&R Race springs. The H&R's were 750-850# front and 265-285# rear so they provide a firmer ride and better handling than the C springs if you want more performance. The ride is not objectionable on the street either, just firm.
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post #20 of 38 Old 01-06-2006, 11:15 AM Thread Starter
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Bilstein's/H&R combo..........lemme check the bank account(shouldn't take long, it's only about 2-digits deep! )
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post #21 of 38 Old 01-06-2006, 03:21 PM
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or another front spring option http://www.colemanracing.com/catalog...?cPath=49_1158

Hypercoils are the same price
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post #22 of 38 Old 01-08-2006, 07:16 PM
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i won't use any spring unless i know the #s

92 black notch v8
89 white notch 4cyl
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post #23 of 38 Old 01-08-2006, 11:11 PM
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I wonder if it's similar to the bilstein bts kit which use HD's and 540-660 and 230-250 springs.
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post #24 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 07:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by two
I wonder if it's similar to the bilstein bts kit which use HD's and 540-660 and 230-250 springs.
Probably not all that different. In other words, more than likely too soft for any serious driving on sticky tires.
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post #25 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 08:51 AM Thread Starter
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Glenn, do you think the HR SUPER RACE springs would be too much for the HD BILSTEIN's? Or would an upgrade to the OE 2000 Cobra R BILSTEIN be needed? The SUPER RACE springs are 950+ rates(in front).
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post #26 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 09:11 AM
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I just got off the phone with Koni and was told that the springs are approx. 20-30% stiffer than stock. That's all I was getting out of ol' Jim on the other end of the phone. He did say that he heard that people were happy with the kit though, must be worth something right!? I'd be willing to bet that this is almost identical to the Bilstein BTS kit. Adding 20-30% spring rate to stock stuff gives you BTS spring rates. Probably makes for a really nice handling and riding car, far from firm though I would guess.
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post #27 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 09:57 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the input, TWO. I was thinking they were along the same lines as my current Eibach ProKit springs which are very similiar to the OE rates, just a small amount lower.
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post #28 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 10:10 AM
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Keep in mind there is a difference between auto-x and track. A super race track spring may be to stiff for auto-x.

99 Mustang GT - Auto-x/track car, 96 Townsend Chassis Late Model Stockcar (sold), 03 F150 - Daily Driver
http://www.youtube.com/user/sandyman099/videos
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post #29 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 10:30 AM Thread Starter
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I was just being curious..........trying to find the "limits" of the HD Bilstein. The normal race springs/C-springs would do me well for my app.
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post #30 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 03:59 PM
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SPRING..............FRONT.............REAR
Stock GT............400-500...........165-265
Stock Cobra.........400...............160
Eibach ProKit coupe.460-570...........200-250
Eibach ProKit vert..460-570 (1.5")....170-310
Eibach Sport (2")...660...............260
FMC "B".............425-530...........200-300
FMC "C".............650...............200-300
FRPP "R"............700-880...........200-260
H&R(1.5")...........???...............275-300
H&R race............750...............265
H&R super race......1020..............300
Susp Tech street....725...............230
Susp Tech comp......850...............280
Steeda sport(1")....650...............200-250
Steeda comp/street..700-850 (1.25")...???
Steeda full comp....850-1050 (1.35")..???
Global West.........800...............160
Global West drag....680...............???
Global West comp....1000..............???
Griggs coil-overs...350 to 500 (50lb).175 4lk
Griggs coil-overs.....................225 TA
Dech speed drive....1000-1200 (1.5")..210-280
Jamex (1.5")........450-550...........170-220
MAC....600,680,700,800,925....160,170,190,215
I hope I got all this right. Let me know if not. Still accepting data!

Darius Rudis

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1989 Mustang S-trim Roadracer
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post #31 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 04:36 PM Thread Starter
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Man, thanks Darius! I've been googling for a page like you copy/pasted but didn't find all I needed. I'm gonna print that off for future reference.

Hmmmmm, never heard of FRPP "R" springs.
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post #32 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 04:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k2GT
Glenn, do you think the HR SUPER RACE springs would be too much for the HD BILSTEIN's? Or would an upgrade to the OE 2000 Cobra R BILSTEIN be needed? The SUPER RACE springs are 950+ rates(in front).
Can't say for sure Tony, but that may be asking too much of the standard valving of the Bilstein. The highest rating spring I ran on mine were the 750-850 progressive H&R's. You might give a call to MM and ask them for a recommendation.

OK, I just checked the MM website and they do have recommendations for both conventional and coil over springs. As I suspected they like the MM Sport valved Bils for the SUPER RACE and the regular HD Bils for the RACE springs. Here is the link to the MM information. http://www.maximummotorsports.com/bilstein.asp

If you want the MM custom valved Bils you can get a great price on them and the H&R springs through Arts Parts. Just do your own research and email Art with the MM part numbers and he will shoot you back his best deal price. I doubt you will get a better price anywhere.
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post #33 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k2GT
Glenn, do you think the HR SUPER RACE springs would be too much for the HD BILSTEIN's? Or would an upgrade to the OE 2000 Cobra R BILSTEIN be needed? The SUPER RACE springs are 950+ rates(in front).
I run H&R Super Race springs with HD Bilstein dampers. I talked to MM about this combo and they didn't recommend it, but said it would probably work. I don't daily drive the car so it is not a big deal. I can't imagine the race valved do that much better of a job. They work fine for me, but once again, I only drive to and from autocrosses. I don't necessarily recommend the super race springs on anything that would see tons of street miles. Also, my car is a fairly light weight fox coupe so YMMV.
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post #34 of 38 Old 01-09-2006, 06:57 PM
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Well, I just bought the Koni sport kit so I'll let you know how it works for me. If it's undersprung for my liking, I'll sell the springs and put something stiffer on there. Have to get off these crutches first though, then I'll let you know.
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post #35 of 38 Old 01-10-2006, 08:53 AM
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Tony, check your PM's.
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