Ol timers-School me on this ESP brake conversion- LEGAL? - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 15 Old 10-28-2005, 07:18 PM Thread Starter
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Ol timers-School me on this ESP brake conversion- LEGAL?

Ok, just can't get rid of the old Stang and will try it in ESP next year. (Locally and perhaps regionally). Cutting off the MM Full SFCs and getting rid of all the illegal mods for ESP. Looking to upgrade the brakes first and trying to update/backdate to 93 Cobra R.

update to 93 Cobra R brakes

Legit? If not, why not?

Any other kits that would suffice? Front or rear, I'm not picky

Thanks, Vic


1990 Mustang GT Triple black convertible
koni yellows-FS on ebay MM cc plates-FS, $130

full length SFCs, aluminum d/s, 4.10s. 5 lug, O/R H, Flowmaster, Pro 5.0 shifter. Stock engine. 14.4 @96
Yeah, I'm retiring the old 5.0 from autocross
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MM Strut brace-sold, G-load brace-sold,
MM rear LCAs - sold

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post #2 of 15 Old 10-28-2005, 11:13 PM
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Should be legal. It's on the same line.

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post #3 of 15 Old 10-28-2005, 11:38 PM
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If you check the parts numbers for the individual pieces in that kit against those for a 1995 R, some of the will be different, almost certainly the calipers, and so technically illegal.

(Someone used to have a great brake conversion web-site, maybe someone remembers.)

There is an allowance in the rules to use alternate parts where originals are no longer available. The burden is on you to prove unavailability. Not an easy task.

All that said, no one locally,except a complete jackass, would protest as the parts are functionally the same. At Nationals, all bets are off.

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#50 ESP/SM2 (backup) - Cal Club
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post #4 of 15 Old 10-29-2005, 08:11 PM Thread Starter
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Come on guys, when I said ol timers, I meant old in Mustang Knowledge, not in years.

Any help?

1990 Mustang GT Triple black convertible
koni yellows-FS on ebay MM cc plates-FS, $130

full length SFCs, aluminum d/s, 4.10s. 5 lug, O/R H, Flowmaster, Pro 5.0 shifter. Stock engine. 14.4 @96
Yeah, I'm retiring the old 5.0 from autocross
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MM Strut brace-sold, G-load brace-sold,
MM rear LCAs - sold

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post #5 of 15 Old 10-30-2005, 01:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by livenfine
Come on guys, when I said ol timers, I meant old in Mustang Knowledge, not in years.

Any help?
Hmmmm. I remember when people used to say "Never trust anyone over 30."

I guess that still holds.

Bob F.
Mustang - The Great American Kit Car
#50 ESP/SM2 (backup) - Cal Club
Porsche - The Great German Kit Car - #50 SM2 Cal Club - #84 JP PCA
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post #6 of 15 Old 10-31-2005, 07:27 AM
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They have the 93 cobra brake conversions still around (93 cobra R). With everything front rotors pads caliper axles ect. It is legal in the update back date area. This kit will convert you to 5 lug (better anyway). Look at Brothers performance or 50 resto I think both have it for around $1,800.00.
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post #7 of 15 Old 06-08-2006, 11:19 AM
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To revive an old thread, has anyone ever found the correct part numbers for a "legal" swap? Calipers? Balljoint spacer? Booster?

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ESP Build Thread: corral.net/forums/showthread.php?t=916068
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post #8 of 15 Old 06-08-2006, 01:26 PM
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The link for the E-bay brake kit didn't work but I suspect that is uses the SN95 rear brake rotors which are not the same as the 93R. That car used rotors and calipers from the rear of a 82 Lincoln Continental. I have a 93R and I confirmed this late last year when I had to replace the piston of one of my rear calipers. I went to the local pick-n-pull and got the part off of the the many Continentals there. I also confirmed that the rotor is the same but didn't need one. What I do not kinow is where the caliper bracket comes from.

"Drag racing is for those people who don't know how to down shift and brake at the same time. "
DD '12 VW Jetta TDI, Race car '87 ITA 16V Scriocco
Cars owned: '86 Mustang GT, '92 Mustang LX, '93 Mustang Cobra "R" #58
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post #9 of 15 Old 06-08-2006, 01:50 PM
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http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts...tKeyField=1791

1987-93 MUSTANG
M-2300-K*
This kit permits owners of 1987-93 Mustang GTs and LXs with V-8 to upgrade their vehicle braking system to 1993 Cobra “R”/1994 Cobra specs. The kit features massive 13.0" front and 11.65" rear rotors, plus spindles, axle shafts, hubs, calipers, mounting brackets, Cobra brake booster and master cylinder, adjustable proportioning valve, hoses, tubes, attaching hardware, instructions and more.

Installation is a virtual bolt-on, requiring only one flared connection. Requires use of 17" x 8" wheels (not included in kit) with 5-hole, 4.5" diameter mounting pattern and 5.75" backspacing. Rear inner fender lips should be “rolled” for tire clearance. Some vehicles may also require front fender wheel well modifications, depending on tire size and ride height.

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post #10 of 15 Old 06-08-2006, 02:10 PM
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Thanks, but as Jim mentioned, the 93 R doesn't use the sn95 rear componentry, so that kit technically wouldn't be legal.

Out back, the easiest thing to do is an SVO rear brake setup, as they're (relatively) easy to come by and definitely legal.

I was wondering about the front though, with regards to part numbers and documentation. Would it be as easy as going to Autozone and getting 94/95 Cobra parts?


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Last edited by vicbaby; 06-08-2006 at 02:12 PM.
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post #11 of 15 Old 06-08-2006, 03:25 PM
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Well the FORD RACING description pretty clearly states that "This kit permits owners of 1987-93 Mustang GTs and LXs with V-8 to upgrade their vehicle braking system to 1993 Cobra “R”/1994 Cobra specs."

Maybe an email to [email protected] will clear things up for you. I don't have a dawg in this hunt, was just trying to help out.

99 Mustang GT - Auto-x/track car, 96 Townsend Chassis Late Model Stockcar (sold), 03 F150 - Daily Driver
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post #12 of 15 Old 06-08-2006, 10:26 PM
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The front part of this kit is the same as a 93R. The 93R came with 94-95 front spindles and PBR calipers with the 13 inch rotors. There were no dust/splash shields installed. It is the rear where things are unique to the 93R as I described in an earlier post. To be legal you would have to piece together the required parts or as mentioned perhaps the SVO brakes are class legal.

"Drag racing is for those people who don't know how to down shift and brake at the same time. "
DD '12 VW Jetta TDI, Race car '87 ITA 16V Scriocco
Cars owned: '86 Mustang GT, '92 Mustang LX, '93 Mustang Cobra "R" #58
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post #13 of 15 Old 06-08-2006, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Brozynski
It is the rear where things are unique to the 93R as I described in an earlier post.
Are the calipers still available? It appears to me that Ford is calling the '94/95 Cobra calipers direct replacements. If that's the case, then they would be legal.

When I did my research before buying this kit in January, I looked at piecing it together, including getting parts at some of the parts stores. I couldn't find any place where I could even pull up '93 Cobra R parts online. I realize that this may not mean anything since there probably aren't too many Cobra R owners buying parts at Autozone or NAPA.

The rest of the kit seems to be ESP legal since it does allow changes to the proportioning valve, brake booster, master cylinder, and brake lines.
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post #14 of 15 Old 06-09-2006, 08:06 AM
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Sandy, that wording says the kit upgrades you to Cobra R specs. Not necessarily that it uses the same parts as the Rs did, which is Bob's point about alternate parts and some jackass protesting.
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post #15 of 15 Old 06-09-2006, 09:29 AM
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Here's the deal. I've got a 88 coupe that's a really nice already set up rolling chassis I've been making into a CP car, and a 92 GT I picked up that I was going to put a mod motor (that I already have) into just for a little Boulevard Pimpin' and to use as a daily driver. However, I've been thinking about doing a few other large scale projects which would require my auto hobby to consume minimal amounts of money... meaning I'd be dumping the CP chassis and trailer and all those spares and making a cheap ESP car out of my 92. No, the car wouldn't be competitive, but I haven't raced in years now and it least it'd let me go out and play and shoot for some local trophies.

I have a complete exhaust (several actually), a good set of seats, S/A Koni struts, D/A Koni shocks, CC plates, springs, SVO complete rear disk setup, sn95 spindles and hubs, and some 5 lug Cobra wheels. Take the T5 out of the CP car (the 92 is AOD), change the 3.73s for some 3.27s, finish the Cobra front brakes and master cylinder, a spare set of wheels and R compound tires and I could go play. Selling the CP rolling chassis and all other spares should more than make up the difference in cost, meaning I could potentially end up with a little cash in pocket.

I've actually thought about SM too, since I have a set of 185 AFRs, coilovers, Griggs race front and rear control arms, and some other bits and pieces. SM would end up being as much a money pit (if not more) than CP because of the extent the modifications could be taken, which is what I'm trying to avoid. I'd rather keep the CP ride.

So anyway... this is why I'm interested in ESP legal brakes, as on the 93 R, and any documentation that may be necessary. It's most probable that the 13" brakes are commonly enough known about that as long as I'm careful and up front with the parts used I won't have any problems. But autocrossing is known to have more than a few cockmunchers who can't stand being beat in a lesser car and will protest you for it.

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ESP Build Thread: corral.net/forums/showthread.php?t=916068

Last edited by vicbaby; 06-09-2006 at 09:32 AM.
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