Test fitted 315's & 10 1/2" wheels on front - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
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post #1 of 40 Old 08-07-2005, 06:33 PM Thread Starter
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Test fitted 315's & 10 1/2" wheels on front

Sorry this is not all conclusive but thought some might to know this much anyway.

When I was changing tires today at auto-x I tried my 10 1/2" Cobra R replicas on the front with 1/4" spacers. They have 315/35/17 Victoracers mounted on them. I tried this before without spacers and the rim just barely touched the strut. With the 1/4" spacer it looked to have plenty of room and even rotated by the wheel weights with no touching on the strut. I also turned the wheels from lock to lock and nothing touched. Here's the not all conclusive part. I had the car on the floor jack while doing this and did not load the suspension or drive it. It looks like it should have plenty of room but I'll try to mount both of them some time and take it for a spin. They stuck outside the fenders about 1 1/2".

When I was putting the car back together to go home I did the fronts first and tried my deep dish 10 1/2" bullets and they were a no go. Would not clear the brake caliper at all.

Running the 315's on the rear has been great and I hope to run them all the way around. Extra auto-x miles have been great. I can't seem to kill these old victos on the rear.

Had a pretty good day and took my 3rd SM win out of 4 events run this year in the Dixie Region.


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post #2 of 40 Old 08-07-2005, 07:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Han Solo
When I was putting the car back together to go home I did the fronts first and tried my deep dish 10 1/2" bullets and they were a no go. Would not clear the brake caliper at all.
What brakes are you running, and what brand of Bullits do you have?


'89 GT convertible, N/A 357W, MM front susp w/425# coil-overs and Koni D/As, MM TA/PB rear setup (Koni Yellows, 390-430# springs), Stoptech 332mm / 12" Baers, MM 6 point rollbar, Maier 1.5" flared fenders & quarters, 18x9.5" front/18x10.5" rear Enkei RPF-1s (street), 18x10" CCW C-10s (track), etc...
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post #3 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 06:45 AM
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FWIW, I have some American Racing Torque Thrust II's(17x11)with Nitto 555R 315/35/17's on them that I test fitted as well. The results WITH the spacer made me smile. I drove the car pretty hard with the 11's on the front and the only rub I heard was a full lock turn......I can handle that.

I believe next season I'm going to get another set of the 17x11's and put the V710 315's on them.
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post #4 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 07:58 AM
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With my 9" 03 Cobras on front with 275 tires I can just stick the tip of my pinky between the rim and the CO spring. Plus I apparently get some minor rubbing on the anti-sway bar at full lock (you might want to check that yourself w/ your 315s). No spacers here, though.

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post #5 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 08:26 AM
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Hell, with 275's and 9" Cobra R's(no spacers)I rub the swaybar and part of the back side(rolled edge)of the K-member.

I also run 17x9.5's on the front for daily driving(275/40), and it rubs the same places, just more easily. You can see where my fender liners have worn through and the paint off the K-member and swaybar are gone.

Didn't a wise man once say, "Rubbin's racin'"?
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post #6 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 09:26 AM
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I also had rubbing on the front sway bar of my 95 Cobra when I ran Cobra R's and 275-40 Victoracers. The inner fenders also took a beating until I stepped up to 850# front springs.

Now, on my 95 GT I have no clearance issues with CCW 10.5" wheels and 275-40 V-710's, which are noticeably wider than the Victoracers. I am currently considering buying a set of 295-40 V-710's if, and a big if, I can fit them without going to a wheel spacer. I tried using a 1/4" spacer on the rears because of some minor clearance issues on the inner wheel well at full jounce but it felt as if I wasn't getting enough stud thread into the lug nut. Not only that but the lug nuts tended to loose some nut torque after running a couple of events, at least compared to the fronts they did. I would not feel confident with wheel spacers unless I installed longer wheel studs and I am just not up for that.

Has anyone been successful running a 295-40 tire up front without wheels spacers or fender flares?
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post #7 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 10:45 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Olsen
What brakes are you running, and what brand of Bullits do you have?
Cobra brakes and wheel replicas deep dish bullets.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k2GT
FWIW, I have some American Racing Torque Thrust II's(17x11)with Nitto 555R 315/35/17's on them that I test fitted as well. The results WITH the spacer made me smile. I drove the car pretty hard with the 11's on the front and the only rub I heard was a full lock turn......I can handle that.
That's good info on the Torque Thrust II's(17x11). What backspace are they? Do you know how much they weigh?

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post #8 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Han Solo
That's good info on the Torque Thrust II's(17x11). What backspace are they? Do you know how much they weigh?
To be honest, I'm not really sure, I want to say it is a 7" backspace. If you goto www.wheelsforless.com and look up the TTII's for the 94> Mustang's, it will give you the specs for the wheel.

I'd like to note that I have stock brake calipers on my GT, just for the record.

As for the weight. A 1/2 worn out Nitto 555R 315 wheel/tire combo is CONSIDERABLY lighter than a 17x9 Cobra R wheel with 275/40 Kumho V710's. I mean CONSIDERABLY!!! It may be just the weight of the V710 coupled with the lightness of the drag radial, but it is alot lighter.
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post #9 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 02:38 PM
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Can you guys post some pics?

I would really like to see the 10.5 deep dish Bullits mounted!


Thanks.
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post #10 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 03:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Han Solo
Cobra brakes and wheel replicas deep dish bullets.
Interesting. I emailed one of the replica manufacturers (can't find the email, I think it was AFS) and was under the impression that the center section of the wheel wasn't changed on their deep dish versions, they had basically just added additional lip to the OEM design. I guess Wheel Replicas must have done their wheels differently to give the deep dish more of a dished look.

Pat

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post #11 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 05:41 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Olsen
Interesting. I emailed one of the replica manufacturers (can't find the email, I think it was AFS) and was under the impression that the center section of the wheel wasn't changed on their deep dish versions, they had basically just added additional lip to the OEM design. I guess Wheel Replicas must have done their wheels differently to give the deep dish more of a dished look.

Pat
I think the difference is the wheels having a depression in the center. It makes them easier to mount tires on if there is a depression to push the bead down into while stretching it around the rim lip. They never intended them to be used on the front or the offset would be less to clear the strut.

I think it's safe to say between 2k2GT's running 11's without rubbing problems and my 10 1/2" Cobra R's clearing Cobra calipers you could get away with the Cobra R's over the Cobra calipers as long as you use 1/4" spacers. The FR500 wheels look like they may have the flat inner rim too but I don't have any of those to try. Mustang Tuning has those on sale for $159.

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post #12 of 40 Old 08-08-2005, 11:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Han Solo
I think the difference is the wheels having a depression in the center. It makes them easier to mount tires on if there is a depression to push the bead down into while stretching it around the rim lip. They never intended them to be used on the front or the offset would be less to clear the strut.
Ah, so the interference was at the inner circumference of the wheel (if that makes any sense)? I just ASSumed it was that the backs of the spokes of the wheel wouldn't clear the face of the caliper.

Pat
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post #13 of 40 Old 08-09-2005, 09:37 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Olsen
Ah, so the interference was at the inner circumference of the wheel (if that makes any sense)? I just ASSumed it was that the backs of the spokes of the wheel wouldn't clear the face of the caliper.

Pat
That is correct.

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post #14 of 40 Old 12-31-2006, 11:33 AM
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OK, so the 17x10.5" Cobra R replicas will fit up front over Cobra brakes, but the 17x10.5" Bullitt replicas won't. Has anyone ever tried fitting 17x10.5" FR500s or '03 Cobras over Cobra brakes? 2k2GT, have you ever upgraded from the stock calipers to the 13" PBRs, and if so, did you try your 17x11" TTII's again on the front?

Thanks,
Pat
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post #15 of 40 Old 12-31-2006, 01:24 PM
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Patrick, I have since upgraded to th MACH1 setup up front(to be specific in these tight tolerance situations), but have NOT tried the 11" up front again, as i've put those wheels on my girlfriends super high performance automatic V6/auto.
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post #16 of 40 Old 12-31-2006, 02:55 PM
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Did I hear whipping noises as I read the last part of that post?
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post #17 of 40 Old 12-31-2006, 03:04 PM
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Well, I wanted some "open-track" wheels on my car, and wanted same size all around. But yea.........the "...I bet those would look good on MY car" comments got old.
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post #18 of 40 Old 12-31-2006, 03:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Olsen View Post
OK, so the 17x10.5" Cobra R replicas will fit up front over Cobra brakes, but the 17x10.5" Bullitt replicas won't. Has anyone ever tried fitting 17x10.5" FR500s or '03 Cobras over Cobra brakes? 2k2GT, have you ever upgraded from the stock calipers to the 13" PBRs, and if so, did you try your 17x11" TTII's again on the front?

Thanks,
Pat
it is because the deep dish bullitts are a reverse mount wheel. so more than likely any reverse mount wheel will not work on the front.
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post #19 of 40 Old 12-31-2006, 05:36 PM
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I am running 18 X 9 Saleen replica wheels on the front with 265 35's and they still rub on a full lock turn. Is it spacers that allow you to do this?

I barely fit 18 X 10's on the back with 305 30's

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post #20 of 40 Old 12-31-2006, 05:52 PM
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Just a thought that popped into my head....The 17x9.5's that I fit on the front of the stock GT brakes barely fits. They WILL not fit with the MACH/BULLIT/COBRA 13" kit without a small spacer.

I have also seen this same 17x11 wheel with a 335/35/17 fitted and it was on the back of a 99> GT.
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post #21 of 40 Old 01-01-2007, 01:19 AM
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it is because the deep dish bullitts are a reverse mount wheel. so more than likely any reverse mount wheel will not work on the front.
I've seen that term, "reverse mount", for wheels elsewhere, but I don't know what that means. Can you explain?

Thanks,
Pat
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post #22 of 40 Old 01-01-2007, 09:06 AM
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Quote:
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I've seen that term, "reverse mount", for wheels elsewhere, but I don't know what that means. Can you explain?

Thanks,
Pat
Not 100% positive on the term, "reverse mount" but I think it means the following: Wheels have a dropped center built into the rim for the tire bead to fit into while mounting. This is usually near the front side of the wheel, which requires mounting the tires from the front side. If you have a really deep wheel sometimes the dropped center is near the back side, this is done for cosmetic reasons, so that you wheel has that "deep dish" appearance. This would also necessitate tire mounting from the rear side of the wheel. This dropped center would interfere with mounting over large brakes, hence a front mounted wheel would not pose this problem.
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post #23 of 40 Old 01-01-2007, 12:13 PM
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OK, that makes sense. Thanks, Glenn.

Pat
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Since this has resurfaced I'll give an update on my preferences.

For Auto-x I am using 17x10.5 Cobra R replicas with 315/35/17 Kumho V710's on all fours with a 5/16" spacer on front. On the 99> with max camber they don't even look like they stick out that much. I ran this arrangement for 6 events in 2 different regions last year and won SM class in all 6. Got my first FTD in one of them. In 2 other events I ran street tires in one and worn out 275's on front in the other and got my ass handed to me. Tires are your friend, wider tires have more grip, sticky tires have more grip, wider sticky tires will produce quicker times. I'm all for learning to drive better but if I can go faster by any means I'll take it. LOL!

For open track I have been running the 17x9 with 275's on front and the 17x10.5 with 315's on rear. The way my car is set up it feels balanced this way. I may try the 315's on all fours at a track event this year just to see how it feels.

Glenn's evaluation on the deep dish rims is correct. For some reason they made the center of the rim a smaller diameter than the non deep dish rims.

All the 27mm offset 17x10.5 rims rub on the strut without a spacer. That doesn't have anything to do with caliper clearance. 315's on the front will rub more than 275's do at full lock. they will also rub some on the fender liners if you still have them. If you have ABS you need to reroute the sensor wire for the passenger side to prevent it from being rubbed in to. Best check both sides, I just removed the fastener that held them behind the plastic fender liner and moved them in behind the struts.

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post #25 of 40 Old 01-02-2007, 12:23 AM
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Thanks for the update, Sandy. I just got a set of flared fenders and quarter skins from Maier, so I'm looking at wheel options to fill up the extra 1.5" of space I'll have a couple/few months from now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2k2GT
The 17x9.5's that I fit on the front of the stock GT brakes barely fits. They WILL not fit with the MACH/BULLIT/COBRA 13" kit without a small spacer.
To bug you for details again... Do you know what offset those 9.5" wide TTIIs were? And did you actually fit them on to the 13" brakes with a spacer, or were you just speculating that they would have fit with a spacer?

Thanks again,
Pat
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post #26 of 40 Old 01-02-2007, 04:49 AM
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+28mm offset, and 6 3/8" backspace

I did actually fit them on to an OE Bullit car at an autocross while we were changing into autocross wheels. The spokes of the wheel hit just BARELY on the edge of the caliper, just above the two round holes on the caliper. A super thin spacer like washer sized would've been all that was needed for clearance.
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post #27 of 40 Old 01-03-2007, 09:38 AM
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Is there any concerns with wheel strength with the Cobra R or any other replica wheel for auto-x/track use? I have always stayed away from replica wheels, or modified OEM wheel for concerns over their processing compared to OEM or a high quality aftermarket.

Am I overly paranoid? If not, then I will have way more options for wider wheels when I go to 5-lug.

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post #28 of 40 Old 01-03-2007, 10:58 AM
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If you are paranoid about any parts on your car, then your driving would be impaired whether your thoughts were true or not.

For me, no they do not worry me. Pretty sure all wheels must meet some form of OE or better quality standards. Don't quote me on that, but I believe it is true.

I do know that the WELD RACING "drag style" wheels say "NOT FOR SOLO, or AUTOCROSS USE". I used to autocross/open track a supercharged Acura integra and the WELDS would've been a good wheel for the 15x9 that I wanted.

On another note, those American Racing Torque Thrusts I have seem to be the absolute WEAKEST wheel(albeit most expensive!)I have ever purchased. They seem to get just minor bending/flat spots from just everyday use. I don't know if it's the large lip of the wheel or what, but it's seen the 2x4 piece of wood and hammer ALOT!
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post #29 of 40 Old 01-03-2007, 11:17 AM
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Funny that you mentioned Weld Racing wheels. I knew some guys running an A-Sedan car that was sponsered by Weld for their wheels, and after inspection at the end of each race, they found cracks in all the wheels. They were not drag racing wheels, but the stresses from track use was enough to make them unusable after a race. This was a few years ago, so the issue may have been fixed.

Do any of you guys dye check the wheels at the end of a season for cracks?

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post #30 of 40 Old 01-03-2007, 11:24 AM
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I don't check them. I figure if they're holding air, and I don't feel or anything in some warm up driving, then i'm ok.

I'm sure wheel failure can happen to any manufacturer, however. I have first hand seen a nice BBS 3pc 18" wheel(mesh looking style)develop cracks(visible)in every single mesh spoke on the wheel.

A buddy of mine just did a huge track day at Sebring I believe it was, and he loaded his car up to go home, then decided to come do some autocross with us the next weekend. The car sat on the trailer untill he backed it off. He did a pre-race drive to check the car for anything and heard something like rocks grinding from the drivers/rear. It was the wheel he was hearing....scary stuff.
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post #31 of 40 Old 01-03-2007, 01:04 PM
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I believe there was a link to a video posted somewhere in this forum of a Cobra that suffered a wheel breakage during an autocross. IIRC it was an aftermarket replica Cobra R wheel. It did a good bit of damage to the fenderwell too. If I get a chance I will try and search for it today.
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post #32 of 40 Old 01-03-2007, 04:13 PM Thread Starter
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I don't dye check my wheels but every time I remove them I wash all the brake dust off and look them over good. So far I haven't seen any problems.

Light weight racing wheels may be more prone to cracking than some aftermarket street wheels. If I was gonna spend the bucks for light wheels I would want the centers to be forged at the least.

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post #33 of 40 Old 01-04-2007, 03:12 PM
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Are any of you guys running coil-overs when fitting the 17x10.5's?
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post #34 of 40 Old 01-04-2007, 03:26 PM
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I'm not. Just regular mustang springs.
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post #35 of 40 Old 01-05-2007, 07:44 AM
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I have C/Os but 10.5" only in the rear (9" in front). No problems with the C/O, but I need to run 1/4" spacers because of the PHB.
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