Lets talk about increasing performance - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 16 Old 08-11-2015, 10:24 AM Thread Starter
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Lets talk about increasing performance

So once again in my life iam deployed with the USMC. Reminds me of when I was in Iraq, spending hours on moddedmustangs.com and here on corral reading threads and talking about improving our foxes. However my plans are very different now. Building a corner carving fox that can keep up with some modern IRS cars from around the world. When people talk about performance and mustangs or any car for that matter, everything assumes building power, im at a point now where im not really concerned about horsepower, im using a stock 5.0. Im more concerned with getting the car to turn and brake better and honestly just learning the car more, seat time!

Anyway, we all know that these foxes are nose heavy and to much of this little 302 sits over the front axle. Not a good thing when you want to go around corners and actually touch the apex.

So I hope you fox/racing enthusiasts will join this discussion with some awesome input and suggestions.

So I plan on dropping another 200lbs off the car in general however I want to focus on removing weight from the front of the car, especially in front of the tyres. So ive found a bilet aluminum bracket kit for the PS pump and ALT which should shed some weight compared to the stock steel brackets, and this kit also deletes the factory tensioner for a simply adjustable rod setup.
On top of that im thinking of swapping the stock pulleys for an aluminum underdrive setup, not just for a few extra HP but for the fact that aluminum pulleys must weigh a lot less than the factory steel pulleys, and this weight is in front the front axle exactly where I need to remove the most weight from.
Another thing ive read, and heard is spinning the stock water pump in higher RPMs for long periods of time is not good, so im sure with the underdrive pulleys which slow the RPMs down on the pump would be a good thing.

Im also thinking of cutting all the sheet metal out on the sides in front of the strut towers, and maybe even mounting the MSD box and coil on passenger side and out of the engine bay. Mounting the ignition products out of the engine bay will not only keep them away from heat but again put some weight behind the front tyres. Another thing if I get real crazy is mounting the coil inside the cabin I could disconnect the ignition from the distributor as an anti-theft. (id have to get some custom plug wire to reach from coil to dis.)

I can also gut the factory hood for some weight loss, ive seen a stock 2013 hood feel like carbon fiber after the owner gutted it...

Another thing I have been thinking about it is removing the windshield wiper parts and sealing the cowl up. I could put the ignition box and coil in there...

I will be removing factory passenger side seat belt stuff which will remove weight, over the 5 pt harness.
I still have insolution behind the dash that can go, as well as some of the dash framework I bet I can remove some.

The doors will be getting gutting and glass removed. I even found a company who makes aluminum door hinges good for 4.5lbs less each.

Ive seen on yellowbullet a guy saw holed his entire front clip (behind headlights and what not)

Id love to make a tubular front end, chop in front of the strut towers and replace it all with tubular aluminum.

Rear hatch is getting replaced with fiberglass hatch and lexan rear window (liftoff) that should shed over 60lbs, no need for gas struts in hatch and hinges, plus im swapping from MM extreme lower control arms to MM road racing arms (they weigh 2.7lbs each) that will shed a decent amount of weight, plus I pulled the rear swaybar which is another 12lbs dropped.


Lots of ideas ive been thinking about

Sorry for the rant, I just don't have anyone to discuss a fox about while overseas and I enjoy planning and improving the car. Its my passion and im curious to hear some other ideas.

Thanks

edit: If someone brings up cooling issue or charging issue because of underdrive pulleys, Im running a 180 thermostat, Aluminum rad, electric fan, heat extractor hood. Car runs very cool, only time I need fan is stop and go traffic. On the alternator topic, im running a 3G and there are no electronics in the car, nor does the car have AC.


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post #2 of 16 Old 08-11-2015, 10:45 AM Thread Starter
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Another thing, iam going to remove the 1inch spacer that separates my Trickflow trackheat intake manifold. This is lower the top of the engine 1 inch, which should help turning and remove a tad bit of weight.


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post #3 of 16 Old 08-13-2015, 10:11 AM
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Several pages of pics from my old fox body racecar... Raced at 3200lbs wet with driver and 200lbs ballast under the RR frame rail.
BTW, appreciate your service!
Mustang Track Car by Ed Hunter | Photobucket
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post #4 of 16 Old 08-13-2015, 11:19 AM
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edhunter, how well did that helmet air cooler work?
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post #5 of 16 Old 08-13-2015, 08:08 PM
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A tubular front end would be the way to go vs cutting up the shock towers [if your running coilovers].

Also, going carbureted would shed some pound in wiring, and other components. Don't forget some forged wheels, or if you really have a deep wallet maybe some carbon fiber wheels.
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post #6 of 16 Old 08-15-2015, 11:14 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the input can't wait to check out the links.

Mr. Hunter your fox (I've seen all over and have pics on my laptop of it)

Mind blowing the amount of work that went into it! That car must have been super competitive!

Gents, my fox is the MM catalog with tubular k up front

Next stop road racing rear arms and forward offset front arms.

I'm going to gut the factory hood in efforts to get this nose heavy car lighter. Among other things I've listed.

I know aluminum heads would be a huge jump, however I like the durability of iron heads, one day I'll run ported gt40 heads

Ive had bad luck with aluminum heads and those fuqqin roller rockers. Pain in my ass adjusting. My engine sounded like a sewing machine! I like the stock style ped mounts, which brings me to another question can you run the pedastal mounts on aftermarket aluminum heads?
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post #7 of 16 Old 08-15-2015, 11:16 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtrain2000 View Post
A tubular front end would be the way to go vs cutting up the shock towers [if your running coilovers].

Also, going carbureted would shed some pound in wiring, and other components. Don't forget some forged wheels, or if you really have a deep wallet maybe some carbon fiber wheels.
Not going carb I like the drivability of efi

Carbon fiber wheels?
I'm not a some professional driver. Competing I just want to drop some pounds off the front and get the car to turn in better and I love working on the car so I can take out weight for free.
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post #8 of 16 Old 08-15-2015, 03:04 PM
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You can't run pedestal mount rockers on most aftermarket cylinder heads. The stand height is incorrect and the hole in the head is much too large.

A company called Yella Terra makes roller rocker arms that are build as pairs on a short shaft. The lash adjustment is done at the pushrod end. This design keeps the valve train quiet and makes the valve guides last much longer.

Roller Rocker Sets - FORD - FORD V8 WINDSOR - After Market Heads - yellaterra

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post #9 of 16 Old 08-15-2015, 09:59 PM
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I'm going in a different direction. Rather than taking weight out, I'm moving it around. I want a comfortable ride, reasonably quiet inside. So, I put some HP under the hood to compensate. Nothing exotic but the motor was designed for A/X duty.
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post #10 of 16 Old 08-17-2015, 12:10 PM
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Id go with an aftermarket hood vs a fiberglass hatch. Taking weight off the front seems to be your main concern. Removing more weight from the rear would shift the weight balance back to the front (if that makes any sense).

Do you have your battery in the trunk yet? Some aftermarket seats will drop the weight nicely. Lightweight wheels are also very important, drop the unsprung weight! You can go crazy with exotic two piece rotors also but on a budget, a basic Cobra brake swap will do.

I wouldnt chop up the strut towers unless you wanted to go SLA front suspension, then they can be deleted all together. Remove the weight from the rear axle yet? Does your car still have cruise control?

If its a street car, I wouldnt go without a wiper/washer system for the windshield.

You mentioned getting rid of the factory seatbelt. Are you running a cage? Wearing a harness on the street will put ALOT of strain on your neck if you were to ever get into an accident (hence the HANS requirement for some race leagues). With factory belts, your body can roll with the force of the impact taking it away from your neck.


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post #11 of 16 Old 08-17-2015, 03:03 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by prez1967 View Post
Id go with an aftermarket hood vs a fiberglass hatch. Taking weight off the front seems to be your main concern. Removing more weight from the rear would shift the weight balance back to the front (if that makes any sense).

Do you have your battery in the trunk yet? Some aftermarket seats will drop the weight nicely. Lightweight wheels are also very important, drop the unsprung weight! You can go crazy with exotic two piece rotors also but on a budget, a basic Cobra brake swap will do.

I wouldnt chop up the strut towers unless you wanted to go SLA front suspension, then they can be deleted all together. Remove the weight from the rear axle yet? Does your car still have cruise control?

If its a street car, I wouldnt go without a wiper/washer system for the windshield.

You mentioned getting rid of the factory seatbelt. Are you running a cage? Wearing a harness on the street will put ALOT of strain on your neck if you were to ever get into an accident (hence the HANS requirement for some race leagues). With factory belts, your body can roll with the force of the impact taking it away from your neck.

Iam keeping my stock hood due to me making a custom heat extractor setup, gutting the factory hood will reduce a lot of weight.

Battery is in trunk, that was first mod i did.

Car has two Sparco Ultra seats, i think they weigh 6lbs each. i plan on removing sliding brackets to reduce more weight and reduce height.

Car has 03/04 Cobra brakes up front.

Im not cutting the strut towers themselves, they are needed for chassis/suspension, Im talking about the thing sheet metal in front of them like where people stuff the cold air intakes on the pass side and where you mount MSD boxes on the driver side, also will be removing fender liners.

Weight from rear axle like quad shock mounts and upper control arm mounts...no not yet always wanted to though.

No cruise control,

Car has a cage, and 5 point harness in drivers seat mounted to the floor and cage, yes i still drive car on the street for fun at times.

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post #12 of 16 Old 08-17-2015, 03:16 PM
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Ive always been a fan of the Steeda heat extractor hood, will probably run that once my car is ready for paint. You can always cut/mold fiberglass :-)
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post #13 of 16 Old 08-20-2015, 10:15 PM
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Just my opinion but, most of the members here who track their cars would likely see the biggest improvements in lap times by spending less money on the cars........and more money on track TIME!

If racing is like sex.....why would you want it to only last 10 seconds. (road races last 25 to 45 minutes!)
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post #14 of 16 Old 08-24-2015, 02:19 PM Thread Starter
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Just my opinion but, most of the members here who track their cars would likely see the biggest improvements in lap times by spending less money on the cars........and more money on track TIME!
yes

you must not have read, my car is in the states and iam currently overseas. Therefore i enjoy our discussions on here chatting about mods and racing. I enjoy the feedback and talking with others who are much more experienced then iam. Since there is no one to talk about foxes over here
i must look else where.


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post #15 of 16 Old 08-25-2015, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EscortSportage View Post
yes

you must not have read, my car is in the states and iam currently overseas. Therefore i enjoy our discussions on here chatting about mods and racing. I enjoy the feedback and talking with others who are much more experienced then iam. Since there is no one to talk about foxes over here
i must look else where.


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I forgot, but now remember you saying that....but the comment wasn't really directed at you personally. More of a general observation from what I see on the site. I'm on track ALOT and regularly pass people with much more developed cars. The difference is I'm truly driving my car at it's limit in the corners/braking while most people are going fast but in straight lines only, nowhere near the cars limit.

Keep talking! But also read/learn what you can about track positioning, threshold braking, etc. It's not the same, but it will help once you can get back in your car.


BTW: Fast and pretty are usually 2 different things. My car is FAST (I own the track record in my class)....but my car isn't pretty. In order to drive at the absolute limits you have to risk damaging the car. If your the slightest bit worried about the cosmetics, you won't push the car as fast as it could be. I know my car had at least 2 front fenders/bumpers put on it before I bought it and I've replaced them once since I bought it 3.5 years ago.

If racing is like sex.....why would you want it to only last 10 seconds. (road races last 25 to 45 minutes!)
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post #16 of 16 Old 08-25-2015, 12:32 PM Thread Starter
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Of course, ive been doing a lot of reading. I bought a skip barber book "going faster" ive also been doing a lot of karting to work on technique. Something i want to try in my fox is trail braking more than threshold braking to keep more weight on the front end to increase turn in grip.

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