Auto-X and Rear Swaybars (or not) on a Fox - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 6 Old 06-19-2015, 04:46 PM Thread Starter
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Auto-X and Rear Swaybars (or not) on a Fox

There is a definite following of people that subscribe to the no RSB club/mentality for Autocrossing their fox. I believe I have even seen Jack H. say that it is beneficial. (that particular car had no TA)

Is this only for those running without a Torque Arm? And those of you doing it, are you using additional rear spring rate to compensate?

What I have basically amounts to a R&T box minus the STB and Steering Shaft. I currently have a PHB, no TA. (and at that it's all still in boxes)

In the future (next summer) I will have coilovers. For now, I have H&R SuperSport springs as a temporary solution (because I already had them) and Koni STR.Ts (because they were cost effective and match the H&R SS)

Next on my list included picking up a set of wheels and tires. I have been thinking about it and now I am leaning towards tires and a Torque Arm. With that comes having to match springs.

Assuming I opt for the TA:
MM Recommends Super Race Rear springs with a TA and SuperSports up front.

If Auto-X is more my focus, would I benefit by stepping up to a MM-42TA5? Will that be enough that the STR.T shocks have issues?


-John
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post #2 of 6 Old 06-20-2015, 05:10 AM
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I have a set of the lighter torque arm springs 42ta5 if you need them. They are practically brand new. They have 3 autocrosses on them. Lmk

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1995 Mustang GT- bbk cold air intake, bbk lowering springs, kyb adjustable shocks, bbk rear sway bar, gripp short shifter, king cobra clutch, bbk shorties, bbk O/R X pipe and flowmaster catback,summit t-lokwith jegs 4.10s and 17" cobra wheels. current ET 13.8 @ 98 MPH on Nitto NT-05r's.
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post #3 of 6 Old 06-20-2015, 08:46 AM
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I think you're going to need to talk to MM about spring rates as I have no idea what "sport" etc. means for rates (I ####ing hate that about how they name conventional springs, just tell us the ####ing rate already!). I will tell you that with my PM3L, when I had stiffer front coil overs (425#) and softer rear torque arm springs, I would pick up the front tires coming out of corners. You'll likely want the stiffer rear springs with a TA for auto-x, sway bar or no rear sway bar. Anything that fixes the quadrabind will want rear roll stiffness, imo. I run the big hollow '98 Cobra rear sway bar on mine.

Re: the Konis, I doubt they'd be up to the challenge once you go TA.
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post #4 of 6 Old 06-20-2015, 12:05 PM
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Im running no rear SB, and i felt like the car turned better. (hoping its not just in my head)

edit:

but then again im on coilovers,and TA/PHB

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post #5 of 6 Old 06-21-2015, 10:53 AM
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I ran MMs adjustable rear bar when I was running the PM3L. Front C/Os at 300#, rear conventional H&R Super Race (280-300# IIRC). This was a mismatch at the rear so I needed to run the bar at about mid point (4 adjustments). Still wasn't satisfactory.

Then I went T/A with the same setup and played with the settings some more. I needed the car to rotate but there wasn't enough rear spring to compensate with the bar. So, I moved up to some older MM T/A conventional springs at 380-420#. This helped a lot and I was able to move the bar back to the first setting.

Still a bit of a spring rate mismatch which I intend to remedy with a rear C/O set-up.

Because there is bind in the stock rear suspension, messing with spring rates is difficult since we don't know the progressive rate the bushings add. I can say that when they bind, the rear comes around pretty fast. This will also occur when the rear springs are too soft for the suspension used (e.g., PM3L, T/A). The shocks will hit their stops and essentially even these suspensions bind - ask me how I know.
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post #6 of 6 Old 06-21-2015, 05:38 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aurdraco View Post
I think you're going to need to talk to MM about spring rates as I have no idea what "sport" etc. means for rates (I ####ing hate that about how they name conventional springs, just tell us the ####ing rate already!). I will tell you that with my PM3L, when I had stiffer front coil overs (425#) and softer rear torque arm springs, I would pick up the front tires coming out of corners. You'll likely want the stiffer rear springs with a TA for auto-x, sway bar or no rear sway bar. Anything that fixes the quadrabind will want rear roll stiffness, imo. I run the big hollow '98 Cobra rear sway bar on mine.

Re: the Konis, I doubt they'd be up to the challenge once you go TA.
According to google, H&R "Super Sport" springs for a Fox are progressives rated at 600-720#.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EscortSportage View Post
Im running no rear SB, and i felt like the car turned better. (hoping its not just in my head)
I keep reading this and that's why I made this thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by qtrracer View Post
I ran MMs adjustable rear bar when I was running the PM3L. Front C/Os at 300#, rear conventional H&R Super Race (280-300# IIRC). This was a mismatch at the rear so I needed to run the bar at about mid point (4 adjustments). Still wasn't satisfactory.

Then I went T/A with the same setup and played with the settings some more. I needed the car to rotate but there wasn't enough rear spring to compensate with the bar. So, I moved up to some older MM T/A conventional springs at 380-420#. This helped a lot and I was able to move the bar back to the first setting.

Still a bit of a spring rate mismatch which I intend to remedy with a rear C/O set-up.

Because there is bind in the stock rear suspension, messing with spring rates is difficult since we don't know the progressive rate the bushings add. I can say that when they bind, the rear comes around pretty fast. This will also occur when the rear springs are too soft for the suspension used (e.g., PM3L, T/A). The shocks will hit their stops and essentially even these suspensions bind - ask me how I know.
That is kind of what I was afraid of. It looks like I would just have to try it and see what happens... with low expectations. LOL

-John
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