Thinking about making an IRS diff cooler - thoughts and input? - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 20 Old 11-26-2010, 01:00 AM Thread Starter
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Lightbulb Thinking about making an IRS diff cooler - thoughts and input?

Hey guys,

I'm looking at getting a IRS Diff cooler but at $1300 from MM that seems a bit excessive for what amounts to an oil pump, AN fittings/tubing, a thermostat, and an oil cooler. I found the exact same pump MM uses (a Tilton I believe) for less than $200 on Summit, figure <$50 for a thermostat and/or override switch, $100 for AN fittings and tubing, and $100 for an oil cooler to mount on the radiator.

Anyone done this themselves and had success or any thoughts or input on this? I'd obviously do a Diff Temp gauge at the same time so I can put that in the tubing as well, and even might skip the thermostat and just do an on/off switch since its really only needed for Auto-X or RR, or driving on some back roads around here anyway.

I haven't bought any parts or started really planning it out, and I'm def open to input and suggestions, or hell if someone has done it already and has pics and input PLEASE let me know!

Thanks,

Eric


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post #2 of 20 Old 11-26-2010, 01:54 PM
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You can get the pump even cheaper and it is the exact same pump as the tilton MM unit. It is a Flojet pump with a Viton diaphragm. You can pick them up at marine stores or marine junkyards because they use them for bilge pumps which are normally oily, watery, and gasoline by products to pump out.

If you find a used flojet unit and not sure which diaphragm it has, you can buy just the viton diaphragm from grainger and swap it out.


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post #3 of 20 Old 11-26-2010, 04:20 PM Thread Starter
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Any suggestions on what oil cooler to use, and where to mount it? Also, I have never worked with AN fittings before and I don't want to chance anything using brass fittings and trans fluid hoses w/ hose clamps; any tips or special tools I should get? I am mechanically inclined (just pulled the Cobra motor in fact) and I would have my ASE buddy with me too but I don't think he's used those fittings since UTI years ago.

I'm wondering if the oil motor isn't made to switch on and off repeatedly so therefore maybe it would be better to just use a manual switch instead of having it switch on and off frequently to maintain a thermostatically controlled temp.

Thanks!

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post #4 of 20 Old 11-26-2010, 07:15 PM
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i'd skip the t.stat for now since you have a gauge and simply see how effective it is first. do you have data logging capability on your car as i'm sure lot of people would love to hear about the results?

the AN stuff is little intimidating at first but tell us the flow rate on the pump you get, the port sizes on the pump as well as the diff and the cooler and i'm sure someone will help out... IF you share the details, results and some pics of the setup that is

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post #5 of 20 Old 11-26-2010, 10:16 PM
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Built my own for my 2000 cobra R. Used mocal/tilton differential fluid pump, canton/accusump check valve, and a 03/04 cobra heat exchanger with 2 spal fans. Installed a hypertech #4026 temp switch in the diff to automaticly turn on the pump. Used -8 braided line and fittings. Pulling fluid from out of the bottom of the diff and returning it to the diff just above the fill plug in the cover. The fluid pump and cooler is mounted just below the rear bumper. Being a 00R, I have side exhaust and no tail pipes which gives me more room below the bumper than 99-04 cobras.
My advise is to use the largest fluid cooler you can get to fit in the amount of room you have to work with. The 03/04 cobra heat exchanger was my 3rd cooler I installed in order to keep the fluid temps down during 20 minute road coarse sessions.

Paul.
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post #6 of 20 Old 11-26-2010, 10:21 PM
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do you have any before and after temp data?

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post #7 of 20 Old 11-26-2010, 10:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pkstang View Post
do you have any before and after temp data?
Up until the 03/04 cobra heat exchanger with 2 spal fans, the diff would peg the 260 degree diff fluid temp gauge and would puke fluid out of the vent tube before the end of a 20 min session. FYI this was with the stock 3:55 gears and a torsen T2R diff.
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post #8 of 20 Old 11-27-2010, 02:52 PM Thread Starter
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Did the pump cycle on/off a lot with the T-stat setup? Thats my only real concern with running one, and w/ a switch I don't mind turning it on manually when I go race, or drive back roads "spiritedly"

Did you run the cooler/heat exchanger in the same place as the 03/04 Cobras, or use straight zip ties to attach it to the radiator, or make brackets? Where did you run the lines, along the subframe (since you DO have side exhaust on your R). Got a good source on the pump you used? I just mentioned the one I saw in Summit as I thot it was funny that it is the SAME pump that MM uses in their kit but way cheaper; I wanna do this on a budget but still use quality parts, just put the "kit" together myself.

Happen to have any pics of your setup?

pkstang - i will DEF be datalogging it before and after to give some results along with specs to share, and to justify all the work/$$$ to myself as well

Eric

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post #9 of 20 Old 11-27-2010, 03:52 PM
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the cooler in the mm kit looks pretty bad ass!

on a side note, you can use a fan out of a streetbike. i had an oil cooler wiht my last setup and used a GSXR750 fan.

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post #10 of 20 Old 11-27-2010, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DuffManRHA View Post
Did the pump cycle on/off a lot with the T-stat setup? Thats my only real concern with running one, and w/ a switch I don't mind turning it on manually when I go race, or drive back roads "spiritedly"

Did you run the cooler/heat exchanger in the same place as the 03/04 Cobras, or use straight zip ties to attach it to the radiator, or make brackets? Where did you run the lines, along the subframe (since you DO have side exhaust on your R). Got a good source on the pump you used? I just mentioned the one I saw in Summit as I thot it was funny that it is the SAME pump that MM uses in their kit but way cheaper; I wanna do this on a budget but still use quality parts, just put the "kit" together myself.

Happen to have any pics of your setup?

pkstang - i will DEF be datalogging it before and after to give some results along with specs to share, and to justify all the work/$$$ to myself as well

Eric
Here is some pics:

http://s123.photobucket.com/albums/o300/2000mcr/

The cooler is mounted underneath the rear bumper on a fabed up bracket that also hold the 2 spal fans.

In my case, the diff pump doesn't cycle on/off. It just comes on at about 160 degrees and stays on during the entire 20 min session. Usually the temp hits about 210 and holds there. I have the pump/fans on a 3 way switch. Off,on and on with temp switch. I got my pump from racerpartswholesale.com

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post #11 of 20 Old 11-27-2010, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pkstang View Post
the cooler in the mm kit looks pretty bad ass!

on a side note, you can use a fan out of a streetbike. i had an oil cooler wiht my last setup and used a GSXR750 fan.
The MM kit is made to have the cooler mounted in the trunk. In my opinion there cooler doesnt appear large enough to keep the diff cool for extended amount of on track time.


The cooler I fabed up holds an additional 2 qts of fliud which doubles the total capacity. I believe this is another factor of why my diff temps stay down.
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post #12 of 20 Old 11-27-2010, 06:30 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2000mcr View Post
The MM kit is made to have the cooler mounted in the trunk. In my opinion there cooler doesnt appear large enough to keep the diff cool for extended amount of on track time.


The cooler I fabed up holds an additional 2 qts of fliud which doubles the total capacity. I believe this is another factor of why my diff temps stay down.
I dont really want to mount the pump in the trunk, nor run the hoses all the way to the front of the car and back again, so I REALLY like the idea of the cooler w/ fans on it mounted near the back. Sure it doesn't have directed airflow on it, but I might be able to fab up a sort of air dam to at least direct cooler air TOWARDS the oil cooler rad, if not like the coolant radiator (does that make sense?)

I can't check out PB here at work so once I get home I'm gonna log on and check them out at length.

What was the pump you used from racerpartswarehouse.com and did you have to drop the diff to install everything? I want to do the FTBR IRS bushing swap so if I HAVE to drop the IRS to do the oil cooler I'll just do it all at once and save myself the second weekend

Thanks!

Eric

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post #13 of 20 Old 11-27-2010, 06:50 PM
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At work, you can get on Corral but not photobucket- thanks kinda funny. HA HA

RacerpartsWHOLESALE.COM not warehouse

http://www.racerpartswholesale.com/p...al_Cooler_Pump

Once you see the pics you'll see how I mounted it. I could have mounted the cooler in a better airflow position that would not have required 2 pusher fans, but I did not like the look of it "hanging" off of the bumper. The way it is mounted now, its barely noticeable.

You dont have to drop the diff to do the cooler, but if your doing the bushings away I will be MUCH easier to tap the diff with it out of the car.

BTW, I open track my car with Bruce from FTBR and hes a great guy. I've got his bushings and IRS knuckle joints in my car.
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post #14 of 20 Old 11-28-2010, 11:09 AM
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my setup

Tilton pump, 2000R engine oil cooler (short & wide), -8AN socketless hose.

Braided is overkill, heavy and difficult to assemble. There is no pressure in the system and if you route the hoses properly they will end-up well protected. The cooler I have is no longer available from FRPP. It's a shame because it packages well under the bumper and doesn't require fans. My temps are 210 with factory exhaust (pump on) and 200 with side exhaust (pump off). The exhaust is the biggest culprit of these high temps. I run a worm gear diff which helps to lower temps.






particularly non-stock 99 Cobra w/brand C motor...

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post #15 of 20 Old 11-29-2010, 10:58 AM
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Just as a reference point, I've got an oil cooler setup for my CTS-V that I got from GM Performance Parts (GMPP). They made the kits (along with various other track-oriented parts) to support the CTS-Vs racing in SCCA T-2. The kit uses the same Tilton pump already discussed and has a cooler with an integral fan. The hose is all -6AN socketless hose - as serpentnoir said, the system isn't under any pressure, so spending all that extra money on braided hose and fittings is just a waste.

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post #16 of 20 Old 03-31-2012, 05:14 PM
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sorry to bring back an old thread but I got a question, can I just use the drain and fill plugs as the pick up and return for the pump or do i need to make different pick up points?

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post #17 of 20 Old 04-05-2012, 10:50 PM
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Existing drain and fill plugs should be just fine.
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post #18 of 20 Old 04-06-2012, 01:05 PM Thread Starter
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Working now instead on an oil cooler using the FRPP part to delete the factory Cobra coolant-to-oil cooler. For what I use the car for, I just wrapped the exhaust that runs under the diff and called it a day. I might add a diff temp gauge later on just to keep an eye, but unfortunately I don't have any reference point of what the diff ran before the wrap and after.

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post #19 of 20 Old 04-07-2012, 06:49 PM
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thats good to hear because I dont feel like having to disassemble my rear to tap the diff cover. Ill def have to build a cooler when I start to get serious about the road course

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post #20 of 20 Old 04-09-2012, 12:24 PM Thread Starter
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If and when you get that far, you will def want to invest in one of the new FRPP diff covers for the IRS - it has fill AND drain holes so you can change the fluid more often, is stronger than stock (although you should still have a diff cover brace and front diff mount brace anyway already), and is already tapped and ready for a oil cooler.

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