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post #1 of 18 Old 08-20-2009, 10:58 AM Thread Starter
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help me out with my suspension and alignment questions

so over the summer i did 95 calipers, spindles, hubs, rotors, pads, softlines, 94-04 balljoints, urethane control arm bushings, mm cc plates, and before that i had tokico blue shocks and struts, ford racing c springs, stock isos in front, none in the rear, griggs std. length subframes underneath, rear is just ranger axles stock width and 5 lug drums, and i also did a k-member brace (4pt. for the stock k member), solid spherical rack mount center drilled bushings from mm, a new rack, new tie rods, and a new ps pump. im on oem 17x8 bullitts with 245/45/17 sumitumo htrz II's.

my ride height is wierd, my back right(passenger) is about a half inch higher than the back left, and ive been told its normal for this and it doesnt mean ive got a warped chassis, but some people still say its a damaged chassis. everyone has different views. cars never been totaled, i rear ended someone going 10-15 i guess and it didn't cause much damage, but that's another project.

so now im back at school, ive invested in some ramps to help me get it up in the air to work on it more ( getting a jack under it is a major pain most of the time), a torque wrench, a creeper, and im gonna pick up two more stands, so ill have 4 stands, and i have a jack.

i paid performance autosport (mustang place out here) to put it on a lift and tell me what i needed, they said my control arm bushings in the front (the poly ones) were very dry, and i needed to lube them, and my rear control arm bushings upper and lower were pretty shot. and my motor mounts are dead, and my h-pipes mount is kinda screwed up where the thing inside the mount has pushed out so that makes noise every now and then.

my plan when i get back is find a h-pipe i like, get that, then get under there and pull it all apart and lube the control arm bushings, and torque everything to spec. i still feel like theres a knock in my front end sometimes, and my ps pump is making allot of noise and the wheels will jitter if you turn it allot going very slow or sitting still, so i dont know what im gonna do about that, but after that stuffs all finished my plan was to get mm's ford upper control arms, and get there XD adjustable lower control arms, at that point aside from iso's im pretty sure that all my bushings will be new. then do bilstein hd shocks, struts, quad shocks and then mm road and track springs with poly iso's in the front and rear. that way i can dial ride height in front to rear, and driver to passenger if it still has the lean.

they sound like concrete plans ? im wondering how i would tell if i have a chassis problem or if its theses c springs settlign wierd, becuase i swapped the springs driver to passenger and pass to driver side and it sat pretty level for a while, then went back to driver side sag.

also i have plans to fix the 95 calipers with stock booster and mc too so i got my brake plans straight. im just wondering what could be knocking in the front end at this point, why the hell my ps is still messing up after ive bled the heck out of the system and back, and why my ride height is so funky.

also would it be a worthwhile investment to do 99-04 shocks and struts?

my alignment is
-left-----right--
caster 2.87 2.92
camber -.66 -.70
toe'd in 1/8th of an inch.

and im still tram-lining allot. i was gonna push the cc plates back an equal amount probably a half inch or so to see if that helps, and i was planning on buying those 2 alignment tools from mm so i can do my alignments and bumpsteer it.

any ideas on what i should be focusing on now please feel free. sorry its so long.


1990 GT hatch 5 speed

Last edited by fivespeedsteed; 08-20-2009 at 01:19 PM.
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post #2 of 18 Old 08-20-2009, 11:25 AM Thread Starter
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talked to jason at mm, he said he thinks my knocking is my sway bar end links, said to take rack limiters out, make it knock then pull the end links and see if it does it, and the ps pump jitter is just the pump being over worked by the wider tires, same with the tram-lining, wider tires, and he thinks the uneven ride height is the old suspension control arm bushings.

evaluate?


1990 GT hatch 5 speed
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post #3 of 18 Old 08-20-2009, 11:25 AM
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Regarding your alignment, I would adjust your cc plates for max caster on both sides. Mustangs can't get enough caster. I have 03/04 Cobra front control arms with the harder rubber bushings, with zero toe-in. I run a lot more (-2.5 degs street, -4 degs track) negative camber than you on 275 tires and tramlining is minimal. I would try fixing the caster and toe to address the tramlining. Also, some tires are more prone to do it than others. Sorry I can't help with the rear ride height problem. Weight jacker rear LCA's solved that for me.

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post #4 of 18 Old 08-20-2009, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fivespeedsteed View Post
toe'd out 1/8th of an inch.

and im still tram-lining allot.
I'm no expert, but I believe you should be toe'd IN, not out
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post #5 of 18 Old 08-20-2009, 01:19 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mlanoux View Post
I'm no expert, but I believe you should be toe'd IN, not out
typo, toed in 1/8th an inch. not out. sorry

what tires do you recommend? pilot sports? g-force sports?

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post #6 of 18 Old 08-20-2009, 01:24 PM
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Setting a slight amount of toe in should help give you some straight ahead stability. You should only set toe out if you're looking for better turn-in response.

Also, I'd try bleeding the power steering system again, that jittering and noise could also possibly be air in the system causing the fluid to aerate. I just replaced my rack and had both until I got all the air out. Now the air is out, it's quiet and doesn't vibrate as I turn the wheels. Of course some noise on the C2 stock Mustang pumps is common too.
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post #7 of 18 Old 08-20-2009, 05:49 PM Thread Starter
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how would you recommend bleeding it?

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post #8 of 18 Old 08-20-2009, 08:12 PM
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Start by the normal cap off, turning the wheel lock to lock with the engine running, I was able to bleed mine by doing this about 5 times over the course of a week.

The best way is to perform a vaccum bleed but you need a special tool. I know most Ford (and probably other makes and private shops) have it. It's an aluminum stopper that allows you to seal the system and apply a vaccum to pull the air out.

I wouldn't know where to get this cap privately though. You may be able to borrow or rent it somewhere or have the local dealer or shop perform the procedure. Also putting a vaccum on it and allowing it to sit with the engine off for 20 minutes or so will verify if the air's out. If the vaccum stays, the air's gone, if the vaccum drops, there's still air in there.
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post #9 of 18 Old 08-20-2009, 11:57 PM Thread Starter
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my friend and i did the cap off turning method, then we took an old cap, drilled through it, put a basket ball needle in there and sealed it off, and pulled vacuum on it and it slowly took less and less vacuum. im pretty sure all the airs out.

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post #10 of 18 Old 08-21-2009, 12:27 AM
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If you have the cap, pump it up to 18 in/hg and let it sit for 20 minutes with the engine off. If it holds that vaccum, the air is out, if it doesn't hold the vaccum, either your cap's leaking or the ps system still has air in it.

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post #11 of 18 Old 08-21-2009, 08:03 AM
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FWIW, I believe the conventional wisdom is that the Tokico blues are basically OEM-level damping...
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post #12 of 18 Old 08-21-2009, 10:30 AM Thread Starter
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i was actually bored and reading an old old mm&ff and i saw that on their project bullitt. they said blues were oem damping. im pretty solidly sure im gonna do bilstein hd shocks struts, road and track springs, poly isos at all four corners, upper control arms and xd adj. lower control arms and mm sway bar end links. jason really thinks that my rear ride height stuff is because of my oem control arm bushings everywhere in the back. and im pretty sure ive done everything else in my power to figure it out but this.

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post #13 of 18 Old 08-21-2009, 10:25 PM
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I think you may want to check the spring clocking on your rear springs and the bottom coil is not completely level... the coils should "end" toward the rear of the car on both sides... if they do not, you will see the back not level... hope this made sense.

as far as what front struts to run, I recommend Koni Yellows... I run them on all 4 corners and am very happy with both street and autocross performance.

I currently do not run any Iso's on any of my springs and if I were to do it again I would run them all the way around, the squeeks and rattles anoy the crap out of me... I guess I might fix that over the off season.

MY LUGNUTS REQUIRE MORE TORQUE THAN YOUR HONDA MAKES
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post #14 of 18 Old 08-22-2009, 12:39 AM Thread Starter
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i played with the clocking and it didnt seem to do much. ive got the top of the spring, the cut pigtail facing front parallel with the axle.

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post #15 of 18 Old 08-24-2009, 05:31 PM
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i'm 99.9% sure that both pigtails on the bottom of the rear springs should be facing the drivers side of the car.

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post #16 of 18 Old 08-24-2009, 08:37 PM Thread Starter
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qtracer on here swears its the other way, but either of us could be wrong. as long as no one knows for sure opinions will be different.

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post #17 of 18 Old 08-24-2009, 09:27 PM
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Just because one person knows and another doesn't, doesn't mean "nobody" knows.

They're supposed to point to the drivers side, end of story. This give them the most positive engagement on the mounting pad even when fully extended.

That said, it never makes a damn bit of difference to whether the car sits level or not. Most times, any unnevenness comes from the front of the car even if it's more apparent in the rear.
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post #18 of 18 Old 08-24-2009, 09:36 PM
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If it's uneven, just turn the adjusting knob on one of the dampers to crank it up or down. Right MFE?
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