help me solve my wandering issue. - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 22 Old 08-10-2009, 10:15 AM Thread Starter
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help me solve my wandering issue.

ive heard my sumitomo tires can do it, and my only having 2.87 - 2.93 ish degrees of caster. someone told me i should be aiming for 6 degrees but that would make the car bumpsteer all over the place. its got mm cc plates, new moog balljoints and tie rod ends, new rack and pinion and pump, solid aluminum bushings for the rack, and new poly ca bushings. it does it mainly on un even roads. smooth roads is fine really. usually does it on rutted or bumpy roads.
and these tires are directionals for sure (sumitomo htr z II), thats their design, that might be it but i want to figure out what it is before i splurge on a new set of tires what else can make it wander around? i had a knocking when turning in a parking lot before i put in some rack limiters and now it doesent do it. im thinking its balljoints or my tires.


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post #2 of 22 Old 08-10-2009, 11:03 AM
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Tramlining. Try different tire pressures and a milder camber setting, but after the tires start wearing into a conical pattern, the problem gets worse and worse. It could be the balljoints, or loose components, but the bottom line is, that's what these cars do, and the Scrub Radius built into the suspension is proably the root cause.

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post #3 of 22 Old 08-10-2009, 03:24 PM
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Check the toe, too. Not enough toe in, or too much toe out will make it worse.

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post #4 of 22 Old 08-10-2009, 08:14 PM
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Check the tire pressure and camber. I have the first generation Sumiitomos and I had some trammeling. I went from 32 psi and -2 camber to 36 psi and -1.25 camber and my problems were greatly reduced. Not saying that is the exact recipe for you but playing with tire pressure is easy to do

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post #5 of 22 Old 08-10-2009, 09:44 PM Thread Starter
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what should the tire pressure be? a little less than what its at? alignment is as follows:
left - right
caster 2.87 2.92
camber -.66 -.70
toe'ed in a total of 1/8th inch. my friends dad do the rack and when he did that he had to redo the toe, and he has a thing that he lays down and measures it out with. what should my toe, caster, and camber be at? i can always try to go get it realigned.

what would you recommend doing with the tire pressure just droping it some?

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post #6 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 02:22 AM
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Not enough caster. Max it out. Most CC plates will get you close to 6 degs.

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post #7 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 09:08 AM Thread Starter
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will that make me bumpsteer?

1990 GT hatch 5 speed
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post #8 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 10:25 AM
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Yes, IMHO. The alignment seems fine other than that. I'd run more like 3-4 degrees just on principle but I wouldn't expect it to solve the tramlining. But it doesn't cost anything to try and you can always put it back.

Tire Rack has a good description of the problem http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tirete...jsp?techid=47&
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post #9 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 12:37 PM Thread Starter
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doesent cost anything? you mean id be okay loosening the strut plate and shoving it back in there and it would be equal? i thought id need a machiene to get it close?

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post #10 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 01:09 PM
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You don't need a machine to try it out. Take careful note of how far each strut top is from its fender edge in case you change the camber setting, and how far each strut top is from the firewall so you can get your caster back where it was. Changing the caster will change the toe a little bit, but not enough to worry about for these purposes IMHO.

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post #11 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 03:24 PM
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I'm probably get flamed for this but I read all these "Tramlining" posts and it's always on bad roads. Any car is going to wander if ruts and potholes are bad if it's fine on smooth roads then the car is fine. No need to go looking for problems where none exists. I wouldn't say my car has wandering issues just because it follows some ruts. Sorry had to vent.
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post #12 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 03:41 PM Thread Starter
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well i had a knocking when you got close to full lock and i wasnt ever sure what it was, i added two more (one per side ) rack limiting c clips to the rack and it stopped and im wondering if its my balljoints (brand new moogs) either dead already or not tight enough. im just not motivated to pull the whole front suspension apart to check it.

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post #13 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 03:49 PM
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You don't have to take your car apart to check ball joints just jack up the wheel place a socket on the inside of the wheel and then a pry bar in between the socket and the ball joint if you have any movement your joints are bad.
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post #14 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 03:58 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stalkan View Post
You don't have to take your car apart to check ball joints just jack up the wheel place a socket on the inside of the wheel and then a pry bar in between the socket and the ball joint if you have any movement your joints are bad.
woah woah run that by me again, you take just any sized socket, like a 3/4 inch well say, set it inside your wheel, with the wheel still tight and attached, and pry the balljoint up, using the socket as a pivot point? how would i go about doign this since there is a grease fitting on the bottom, just do it to each side of it?

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post #15 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 04:38 PM
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Well not any sized socket, what you want is to close down the gap in between you ball joint and the wheel. Then pry on the sides if you have a grease fitting in the way. You can also pry in between the control arm and the spindle and see if there is any play there but be careful with the ball joint boot you don't want to tear it.


Edit: Scratch that bit about the spindle. A better way to do it is while the wheel is jacked up, face the wheel, place the pry bar under the tire with the pivot point just inside the wheel, and pry up and down. That way you don't have to worry about the boot.

Last edited by Stalkan; 08-11-2009 at 05:00 PM.
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post #16 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 06:04 PM
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I was going to say, just support the car by the frame and put the pry bar under the tire, if you don't feel movement, you're good to go.
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post #17 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 06:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ91GT View Post
I was going to say, just support the car by the frame and put the pry bar under the tire, if you don't feel movement, you're good to go.
I'm always thinking of the car on the rack hence my first example, but this is a much better way with just a jack.
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post #18 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 10:31 PM Thread Starter
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ive heard you cant do a conventional balljoint text with a macpherson strut setup though, you just jack it up by the control arm or the frame and try to pry the wheel?

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post #19 of 22 Old 08-11-2009, 11:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fivespeedsteed View Post
ive heard you cant do a conventional balljoint text with a macpherson strut setup though, you just jack it up by the control arm or the frame and try to pry the wheel?
Think about it, you're checking the balljoint to control arm for looseness. Therefore, you need the control arm to be supported or have pressure against it so that it doesn't move easily with the balljoint as you pry under the tire. Since the spring is still putting downward pressure on the control arm when supported by the frame (otherwise the spring would fall out when you jack the car up), so you should be able to test it whether supported by the control arm or frame.
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post #20 of 22 Old 08-12-2009, 08:00 AM
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Try it both ways it'll only take a second longer, conventional and with a socket how I described.
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post #21 of 22 Old 08-12-2009, 08:17 AM
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Does that method work with coilovers?
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post #22 of 22 Old 08-12-2009, 08:23 AM
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With coil overs your going to have to go in between the spindle and control arm.
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