Diagnosing in-op Cruise Control. 1990 GT - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 25 Old 06-14-2019, 03:34 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Diagnosing in-op Cruise Control. 1990 GT

Cruise has been in-op for around 12 years or so. I'm sick and tired of it. I want god damn cruise. 1990 GT

Alright here's what I've checked...

VSS Good. Verified working via data logging.
Neutral Safety switch. Via clutch pedal works. Unsure if the one mounted on the transmission is part of the cruise system.
Brake pedal dump valve. Moved it so that it is flush and resting against the brake pedal as far as it can go.
Vacuum line from hose tree to fender is hooked up with no leaks.
Cruise/horn/lighter circuit good. Has power.

I remember long ago if I pushed off/on at the same time on the cruise my horn would honk. It doesn't do that anymore. My clock spring does have a small issue. It triggered an airbag code about 7 years ago. I just put a resistor in the column to simulate the airbag was plugged in and dis-connected the bag. There is no off the shelf clock spring specifically for a 1990. However I've read some people retro fit Dorman 525-201. I just ordered one and will have it tonight to install.

If I can verify the clock spring is sending correct voltage and signal to activate the unit.... then what? What's next?

Is there anything I can probe for a voltage signal in the column to verify the clock spring is sending the on signal to the module? The car is programmed not to activate cruise unless at 30 or above. In theory could I change this in Binary editor to say 5mph to make it easier to diagnose while the car is on jackstands and the wheels are spinning?

Thanks guys.


Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 25 Old 06-14-2019, 05:26 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
https://mustangforums.com/forum/5-0l...or-module.html

I found this for diagnostics.


Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #3 of 25 Old 06-14-2019, 06:13 PM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
LET US know how that troubleshooting chart works

Sigmund never followed up that thread.

It’s pretty simple circuit, and the amplifier checks for 7volts on the monitor through the brake lights
If you have led brake lights you will not have cruise without a resistor simulating a filament bulb

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 25 Old 06-14-2019, 06:23 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Quote:
Originally Posted by indy2000 View Post
LET US know how that troubleshooting chart works

Sigmund never followed up that thread.

Itís pretty simple circuit, and the amplifier checks for 7volts on the monitor through the brake lights
If you have led brake lights you will not have cruise without a resistor simulating a filament bulb

Will do. I don't have LED anything except for my tag lights and cluster illumination lights.

Hopefully this new clock spring doesn't take too much modding to make work. A shame my 1990 needs a specific one.

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #5 of 25 Old 06-14-2019, 06:58 PM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
you could convert to non airbag wheel and have tilt column put in

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #6 of 25 Old 06-20-2019, 08:03 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Update, that Dorman part wasn't going to fit. Not even close.

I was able to clean up and restore clock spring function to horn and cruise but not airbag. I tested the voltages in the column and all buttons are working correctly and sending correctly.

I have a spare module from a 92' that is in working order. I swapped it out today but no luck. I pulled the fender cover out and checked all the vacuum lines to the servo. They all work perfectly and the dump valve works correctly as well. So from here I'm going to check the resistances of the different circuits of the servo itself. This is going to SUCK BALLS because of where that damn pig tail is under the dash. My guess is the servo.

I remember a problem I had a long time ago.... My car had an electrical issue about 18 years ago where whenever I'd push the brake lights the fuse would pop. I had a shop fix it as I was not mechanically inclined then. When I got the car back the cruise control no longer functioned. I went to take the car back and the shop was out of business. The brakes lights were operational so I figured meh...who needs cruise anyway... I'm wondering if when I check the pins it will point me to an issue with the brake switch...

Back to under the friggin dash...

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #7 of 25 Old 06-20-2019, 09:44 PM
Registered User
 
JV106's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (0)
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Crandall, TX
Posts: 363
Does your horn work? I had a penny stuck in my cigarette lighter and it took out that whole circuit for years. I felt like a king when I found it.
JV106 is offline  
post #8 of 25 Old 06-20-2019, 09:57 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Quote:
Originally Posted by JV106 View Post
Does your horn work? I had a penny stuck in my cigarette lighter and it took out that whole circuit for years. I felt like a king when I found it.
Yes, that circuit has power.

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #9 of 25 Old 06-21-2019, 02:45 PM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
Make sure the cruise monitor circuit is not open or short to ground

It is integrated to the brake light circuit

If the repair removed that monitor the cruise will never turn on, it will be in a permanent off state

It also must go through the clutch sense switch, the switch that activated by the clutch pawl

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #10 of 25 Old 06-23-2019, 02:40 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Quote:
Originally Posted by indy2000 View Post
Make sure the cruise monitor circuit is not open or short to ground

It is integrated to the brake light circuit

If the repair removed that monitor the cruise will never turn on, it will be in a permanent off state

It also must go through the clutch sense switch, the switch that activated by the clutch pawl

Do you by chance know which pin/wire that is for me to check at the module?


Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #11 of 25 Old 06-23-2019, 09:43 AM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
R/LG wire from amplifier, from memory

pm a email, i will send you diagram of the circuit with pin number when i get home

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #12 of 25 Old 06-23-2019, 10:39 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Quote:
Originally Posted by indy2000 View Post
R/LG wire from amplifier, from memory

pm a email, i will send you diagram of the circuit with pin number when i get home
Thanks Indy. madevilmustang(at)hotmail.com

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #13 of 25 Old 06-24-2019, 12:19 AM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
sent

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #14 of 25 Old 06-26-2019, 04:40 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Alright here’s what I’ve got. The Red/light green strip wire is cut at my brake switch. I raced it to a pig tail inside the kick panel. It only has battery voltage when the brake is pushed.

With ignition on Checking the that red/light green wire at the amplifier it has a steady battery voltage. (I used a needle to poke it) If I push the brake no change other than a slight drop from the tail lights. From what I’m understanding this should only see voltage if the brake is pushed. Not all the time. Correct?

Also white/purple is getting battery voltage as well.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg F9B699B5-3668-44A1-8BD8-211A052F5F74_1561581341450.jpg (57.9 KB, 9 views)
File Type: jpg 7C1318B5-756E-4DD2-A4D5-45DD15137923_1561581481149.jpg (80.6 KB, 9 views)
File Type: jpg 9BDF469C-B2C1-4806-84FE-A7CF760921EE_1561581500018.jpg (57.5 KB, 9 views)

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #15 of 25 Old 06-26-2019, 05:41 PM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
That wire puts out 7volts

With a proper brake light, that will be pulled to ground, that will tell the amp the clutch switch is closed

If the clutch switch is open or the brake light bulbs are open the 7volts will tell the amp ‘no cruise’

If you are in cruise, ie the brake lights are pulling the 7volts to ground

And you step on the brake pedal, that battery voltage to the amp will say no cruise just the same

Therefore, yes you should not see batt voltage to that pin unless the brake switch closes

Someone messed your wiring up

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #16 of 25 Old 06-26-2019, 05:44 PM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
The amp needs to be powered

I will assume that white wire is the powering up circuit, just guessing

Wiring diagram is not in front of me

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #17 of 25 Old 06-26-2019, 06:01 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Update... I found the factory wire that was bypassed and tested it. No ground outs or anything. I hooked it back up and brake lights work fine. Not sure why the mechanic did that.

But the red with light green into the amplifier still has 12v. My brake lights aren’t on.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 659DD895-3646-467D-8EEC-A99FF3180AFB_1561586399881.jpg (92.9 KB, 6 views)

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #18 of 25 Old 06-26-2019, 06:55 PM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
does a test light light up?

does the 12volts still exist when you step on the clutch?

if you have 12volts on that wire, you have 12 volts at the brake lights

you have to.

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #19 of 25 Old 06-26-2019, 07:13 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Alright so here’s what’s weird. I used a test light as you suggested. At the pedal the switch works correctly and lights it up. Checking the wire at the amplifier it reads 12v but won’t turn the light on. I used both meter and light at the same time and when I do this it goes to Zero. I remove the light, back to battery voltage But when I push the brake down with all this hooked up, no light, no change.

What the hell......do I have another break in that wire somewhere and the amplifier is back feeding a tiny 12v signal?

I need a beer and a priest I’m thinking. I’m shot for the day my shoulders are hurting and my back is killing me. I’m half tempted to cut that damn wire at the controller and just rely on the vacuum dump to turn off the cruise.

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #20 of 25 Old 06-26-2019, 07:22 PM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
remove the power feed to the amp

recheck the wire

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #21 of 25 Old 06-26-2019, 10:04 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
Will do and report back. Thanks.

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #22 of 25 Old 06-26-2019, 11:01 PM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
cutting the wire wont'd work by the way, it needs a ground

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #23 of 25 Old 07-06-2019, 09:06 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
So I followed that online post and checked all of the ohms on my servo and everything checked out OK. I checked all the voltage at the controller and the wiring and that came out OK to. However when I use this troubleshoot method in the picture I cannot make the servo energize itself to test for function. I also cannot find any online resources on how to make sure that the cable is adjusted correctly.

God this sucks.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 7C050DCD-DE28-4491-A8D0-A9C158ACB4C2_1562461464616.jpg (117.5 KB, 4 views)

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
post #24 of 25 Old 07-06-2019, 09:15 PM
Registered User
 
indy2000's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (3)
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: vancouver
Posts: 21,087
i have the cable adjustment info

if you cannot bypass the amp, that indicates an open

did you fix the 12 volt problem

89 GT gr-40, KB2200(10psi), tweecer R/T,LC-1, 22gal cell, w/tailpipes.
indy2000 is online now  
post #25 of 25 Old 07-06-2019, 09:29 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Nitrous SSC's Avatar
 
Trader Feedback: (7)
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Layton, UT
Posts: 7,192
I figured out the little metal clip that I have to remove at the throttlebody linkage I pulled the access through until it was tight and then put the clip back in. It moved a solid inch Of play.

Matt, 90' GT 347, 6037 heads, V1 Si-trim, 11psi, B31 Cam, T56, SV Intake, BE/Tweecer Tuned. 550rwhp 513tq
Bonneville 130 club member. (139.993) [email protected] in the 1/4.
03' Sonic Blue Cobra 497rwhp 481tq
13' Taurus SHO Performance PackDaily
Nitrous SSC is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Bookmarks

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome