Axle for 10.80 and do I need c-clip elims? - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 21 Old 09-08-2008, 05:03 PM Thread Starter
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Axle for 10.80 and do I need c-clip elims?

Okay, my current setup is an 11.50 setup, but I need to upgrade my axles and I would rather only do it once. The car will go 10.80's with my other supercharger pulley if I ever get the cage. I have a few questions.

Are c-clip elims required to run 10.99 or quicker?
Do rear disc brakes satify the axle retention requirement?
Do they make c-clip axles that are compatable with c-clip elims in case I want to wait on the c-clip elims until I get the cage?

What are the best axles without going overboard for a 10.80 setup. It would be a little over 500rwhp with 3.55 gears, 26 inch tire, Tremec 3550, and 3600lb race weight.

My current setup with ET Street Bias Ply's is 11.50 @ 119mph so it is probably about 420rwhp.

Thanks


1993 LX HB, Dart big bore 347, Ported Cobra Intake, 70mm TB, Edlelbrock 6037s, FTI custom emission friendly blower cam, 60lb inj, Bullet MAF, Vortech SQ Trim, TKO500, JBA Shorties, 3.55's, and Tweecer R/T
10.84 @ 128.5mph
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post #2 of 21 Old 09-08-2008, 05:45 PM
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https://forums.corral.net/forums/show...IP+ELIMINATORS

This is what I found in the search!


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post #3 of 21 Old 09-09-2008, 05:51 PM
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if youre planning on going 10.80's you MUST have aftermarket axles.

first line in the chart:

http://http://nhra.com/tech_specs/ETQuickRef.html

i was also told by NHRA tech that if your car runs 11.49 or faster c-clip eliminators are required.

Call Strange Engineering and talk to J.C. he'll work with you and he wont screw you around.

-Tony

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post #4 of 21 Old 09-09-2008, 06:36 PM Thread Starter
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The link didn't work for some reason. As far as I know, and "axle retention device" is required for 10.99 and quicker. Aftermarket axles may be required for 11.49 and quicker. I am getting aftermarket 31 splines. The problem I have with the Strange is that I can't ever upgrade to disc rear brakes with those. I would rather get a c-clip axle and upgrade to disc brakes and use that for my "axle retention device" if that is acceptable at the track. Strange does not appear to make a c-clip axle for the Fox.

1993 LX HB, Dart big bore 347, Ported Cobra Intake, 70mm TB, Edlelbrock 6037s, FTI custom emission friendly blower cam, 60lb inj, Bullet MAF, Vortech SQ Trim, TKO500, JBA Shorties, 3.55's, and Tweecer R/T
10.84 @ 128.5mph
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post #5 of 21 Old 09-09-2008, 10:54 PM
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If your sig is correct, you spent the money on a nice engine block, and I'm sure the internals are nice... Why would you want to second guess what to put in the rear?
At the risk of sounding like an ass..
Use the wrong stuff and you run the risk of putting a nice car into the wall due to a broken axle and trying to skate the "axle retention device" rule. YOU know what they are talking about, step up and do it right...once!

Here's a suggestion, if you're going to be putting c-clip elim's in, you're going to have to cut part of the housing to make them work. why not just put 9" ends on it and be done with it. At that point you'd have many rear disk options!

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post #6 of 21 Old 09-10-2008, 10:07 AM
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Disc brakes do not qualify as an axle retention, had a buddy that checked on it.
Seems like I remember seeing something years ago that stated if you run slicks you must have c-clip elims, but I know for sure at 10.99 you have to have them.

I installed Moser elims when I put the spool in the car. I did the work myself, not too big of a deal as long as you've got a sawsall and grinder/file.

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post #7 of 21 Old 09-10-2008, 10:08 AM Thread Starter
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Well, you are correct. I am just leaning towards the Strange with eliminators right now. The wife is definitely pissed at me right now and I just don't have any more time and money to spend on the car. I went 15 years racing this thing and never towing it. I got a good Pro-motion clutch 2 weeks ago and had to tow the thing twice in 4 days because of a broken axle. I would have put the good stuff in after the 1st break, but I was racing in Pinks All out the next day and had to just get it back together.

I need to investigate the 9" ends, but it sounds expensive and I don't know who will do that around here. Do you have to get custom axles with the 9" ends on? I am assuming yes which means more money.

Do c-clip elims retain the axle better than discs? I wish I could see a better picture of the elims because I don't know how they work. How do they hold on to the axle?
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post #8 of 21 Old 09-10-2008, 02:35 PM Thread Starter
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I just got a quote from the shop that installed my gears 12 years ago. They want $85 for the ends and $180 for the labor. They also want $500 for Moser axles! I wouldn't buy the axles from them because that is way too much, but the labor and 9inch ends still just adds too much to it right now. I can't spend that kind of money on it. I went way over budget when I got the clutch and upgraded the tranny to a 26 spline input shaft. I am either going to have to just get some c-clip axles and stay over 11.50 or get the Strange with the eliminators. I am leaning towards the Strange setup because they seem to be stronger from my research and I like the axle retention even if I stay at 11.50 because I really don't want to go into the wall! The stockers break immediately, but I read about an aftermarket one hanging in there a little longer and then shooting the guy towards the wall as his wheel passed him by.

1993 LX HB, Dart big bore 347, Ported Cobra Intake, 70mm TB, Edlelbrock 6037s, FTI custom emission friendly blower cam, 60lb inj, Bullet MAF, Vortech SQ Trim, TKO500, JBA Shorties, 3.55's, and Tweecer R/T
10.84 @ 128.5mph
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post #9 of 21 Old 09-10-2008, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Need-a-cage View Post
Well, you are correct. I am just leaning towards the Strange with eliminators right now. The wife is definitely pissed at me right now and I just don't have any more time and money to spend on the car. I went 15 years racing this thing and never towing it. I got a good Pro-motion clutch 2 weeks ago and had to tow the thing twice in 4 days because of a broken axle. I would have put the good stuff in after the 1st break, but I was racing in Pinks All out the next day and had to just get it back together.

I need to investigate the 9" ends, but it sounds expensive and I don't know who will do that around here. Do you have to get custom axles with the 9" ends on? I am assuming yes which means more money.

Do c-clip elims retain the axle better than discs? I wish I could see a better picture of the elims because I don't know how they work. How do they hold on to the axle?
The Ford 9" is set up the same way as the C-clip eliminators... the bearing and outboard housing is pressed onto the axle and then bolted to the axle housing. I've heard people have had problems with some of the elim. kits leaking.

The Ford 9" inch is superior to all other rear-ends IMHO. If I were you I would save up the cash to get a complete Currie 9" setup with disc brakes. You can sell your current set up and then get some 3.55's for the 9".

If you simply want to weld in the 9" ends on your existing axle you would just have to buy 31 spline axles (the Ford 9" uses 31 spline also) and then shorten your axle housings to the proper width and weld the ends on. If you don't want to go with a complete rearend upgrade, I would go with the Ford 9" ends.

Joe F. can do this for you... he has all the equipment for shortening and welding rearends.

-Ron
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post #10 of 21 Old 09-10-2008, 03:39 PM Thread Starter
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A complete 9" is definitely out of the budget!

Maybe I should talk to Joe.

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post #11 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 11:56 AM
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I run the Strange 31 spline S/S axles with c-clip eliminators and Aerospace disk brakes. No problems here.

X275 build in progress follow on Mustang Junkies.net

http://www.mustangjunkies.net/f9/project-dirty-red-444
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post #12 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 12:05 PM Thread Starter
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Any leaks? How much power to the ground or what ET's do you run?

I did find out that there are two disc brake kits that work with the eliminators. However, Strange and the guy on here that sells the Strange stuff both highly recommend the 9" ends. This will add some down time to the car though if I go that route.

1993 LX HB, Dart big bore 347, Ported Cobra Intake, 70mm TB, Edlelbrock 6037s, FTI custom emission friendly blower cam, 60lb inj, Bullet MAF, Vortech SQ Trim, TKO500, JBA Shorties, 3.55's, and Tweecer R/T
10.84 @ 128.5mph
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post #13 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 12:23 PM
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Well I would recommend the 9" ends as well but when I built my rear a few years ago I had no access to a welder. Now that i do I might go to 9" ends when I blow this rear. I haven't had any issue with leaking eliminators like some others have.

Team Z can do the 9" ends for you www.teamzmotorsports.net/differential.html#axles. Shipping would probably be killer though for you. I'm sure you have places by you that can do the same thing.

I'm not sure of the power level I am at but it does run 10.60's.

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post #14 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 01:08 PM Thread Starter
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It sounsd like those axles will work fine for me. There is a place not too far but they want $180 to do it and the parts are about $100 more. It will also increase down time because I'll have to take the rearend out.
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post #15 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 03:23 PM
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Get the 9" ends

The labor is a little higher than what we pay here but that is expected. Make sure that the tubes are welded also.

I would recomend a Pro race axle 5/8 studs.

They are a little more but well worth it. I have busted enough rear end stuff over the years to finally get a piece that has lasted 3 years with no damage.

Most 9" housings that are sold have the wrong upper control arm mounts. Team Z's is correct.

I have had the rear end in and out of my car in about 3 hours when I had some brackets welded on it last year.

I just remove the housing leaving all the brakes in place.

Tim

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post #16 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 03:41 PM Thread Starter
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Strange tech said not to run the Hy-tuf axles on the street. He said I need to run the S/S axle. He said that bumps can cause cracks in the through hardened axles.

The guys that quoted me the$180 said that they do not weld the tubes to the housing. They said that they are disimilar metals and don't weld very well. This makes me weary of using them. I am always reading about people welding them so what is wrong with these guys?

1993 LX HB, Dart big bore 347, Ported Cobra Intake, 70mm TB, Edlelbrock 6037s, FTI custom emission friendly blower cam, 60lb inj, Bullet MAF, Vortech SQ Trim, TKO500, JBA Shorties, 3.55's, and Tweecer R/T
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post #17 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 03:51 PM
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I have 3000 miles on my pro race stuff no issues. they mentioned it would be possible to bend one but not cracking.

Plus how much of a bump is really getting to the axle with a big tall tire. I would not be woried about it one bit.

Find someone else to weld the housing ends. Yes the metels are diff but it has been proven that with the proper wire that there are no issues.

I also recomend a set of braces on the tubes. they will bend without them.

Tim

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post #18 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 04:20 PM Thread Starter
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Well, this is what he said.

-----------------------------------

Our HY-Tuff axles are not recommended for street driving since they are thru-hardened to the core there is no flex in the flange area. Hitting bumps, railroad tracks or pot holes could cause a crack in the axle over time. Eventually it would probably break off at the flange. There is no posi unit that would hold up to that, you would eventually keep burning up posi units. Thanks

---------------------------------

This is getting expensive. I may have to do something cheap for now and just run radials and 11.60 until I can afford to do it right. I want to go to 5-lug eventually also but I just can't spend the money. The wife saw me looking at axles and when she saw the price she threatened to sell the car! The axles are only half of it!
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post #19 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 04:45 PM
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Well, this is what he said.

The wife saw me looking at axles and when she saw the price she threatened to sell the car! The axles are only half of it!
...and they wonder why guys hesitate to get married
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post #20 of 21 Old 09-11-2008, 06:27 PM
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...and they wonder why guys hesitate to get married
My wife knows how much I spend. My best line is it is for saftey.

My rear cost me about $2100 or so with all the little stuff. Crap the drive shaft was $650 with the yoke.

Tim

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post #21 of 21 Old 09-12-2008, 10:07 AM Thread Starter
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My $500 rearend upgrade is going to turn into a $2500 fully built 9"! I can't let that happen this time. This is starting to feel like my $2000 306 shortblock that turned into a $6000 Forged Dart Stroker with custom cam.

I would tell the wife it is for safety, but then she would say that it would be safer to sell the car and the motorcycles!
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