Rookie racer looking for a couple more tenths on a tired motor. - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
 
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post #1 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 11:32 AM Thread Starter
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Rookie racer looking for a couple more tenths on a tired motor.

Sorry for the rambling post. See the mods in my signature. Just started drag racing. A bit overwhelmed learning to navigate the T-5 runs, but I am ADDICTED! My shortblock is getting tired, I see a lot of smoke in the rearview as I go through the traps. 130 pounds compression in all the cylinders. (I suspect not too good with 58cc AFR 165s). Blowing a lot of oil into the intake. Be a couple months before I can afford a shortblock Considering a 331 or 347 perhaps.

Anyway, I know these times are lame, but I have a few runs in a row that are consistent so I probably need to do something different to improve. NA data of course, I haven't used the nitrous yet. Thought I better learn to drive first. Here's a typical pass. Be gentle please, it's painful to see near stock SN95 numbers after the money I've spent.

60FT- 1.98
1/8- 9.27 @ 74mph
1000FT- 12.11
1/4- 14.5 @ 94mph

New ET Streets are hooking, shifting around 5300, feels strong until midway through third, then it just seems weak. I need a tach I can read during the runs. No doubt there is a few more tenths just with experience. Traction is very respectable. I think it will be perfect once I install the linelock.

I'd like to work toward a 13.99 before I go shortblock. Considering a tune, though it's probably a waste of money since the shortblock is leaving soon. U/D pullies worth anything? Better fuel pump won't help will it? Base timing is at 15, fuel around 40. Radials at 20psi. Car is lightened 100 pounds perhaps. (I'm counting floor mats, spare tire etc).

I'll spend a lot of money over time, but I can't spend $300 for each .05 improvement at this point. Looking to get the easy improvements first. Thanks.


94GT-T5 Fordstrokers DIY 347, TW190 FAC-Ported Victor EFI-FTI Cam-90mm LMAF-85MM TB-42s-LTs-4.10s QH tuned. 12.10 @119.50 NA.

Old combo- 306,AFR165,FTI,12.88 @108 NA, [email protected] on 100 shot.
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post #2 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 11:51 AM
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I think you should work on getting the car running right. There's no way a HCI car should be trapping 94 MPH. My bone stock 89GT trapped 95 You gotta look at fuel pressure and timing again... I bet one of those two are totally out of wack. When was the last time your fuel filter was changed? The whole oil burning thing could be a number of things. If the heads are relatively new, its probably blow by on the bottom end or blowing in the intake. Something isn't right there. Pull the TB off and see if there's a puddle of oil in the upper intake. Try pulling your dipstick tube out just a little so air can vent out of there. Do a few WOT pulls and see if you are still blowing smoke. If its smoking less then you have a PCV issue causing pressure in your crank case.

You have the parts to get into the 12s, no joke. My 92 coupe with kinda sorta the same parts runs 12.37 @ 112 on motor. Your car minus a cam and extra weight should be able to do AT LEAST 12.90s.

Also, the 1.98 60' times on ET streets is no good. You need to either play with the tire pressure, get some control arms, rebuild your rear diff, get more aggressive, or a combination of all of those. FYI, I rebuild my stock diff and went from 1.85 60's to 1.67's on 245" Nitto DR's. There's a half second left in just the 60' on this car. How do you launch the car? Watch my "atco" video in my signature... you should be doin somethin like that.


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post #3 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 11:51 AM
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Try a shift light if using the stock tach , I shift @ 5800 (shift light) and the stock tach is around 7000

308, AFRs, Systemax upper/truck lower, TKO 500, race gas
[email protected] NED (1/8th) 10/19/16 - 1.47 M/T Stiff wall slick
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post #4 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 12:26 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the help JD and Rednotch. I'll study the vids. A few additional comments that probably make my times even more pathetic.

8.8 internals are fresh and seems to be in good working order.
Seems clean around the TB, but the PCV is definitely pulling oil into the intake on a hard pass. My compression is way down at 130# right?

Unimpressed with my 60 foots huh? I improved a couple tenths yesterday. I do need some control arms or SFCs. I am just now experiencing any similarity to a drag launch. Old street radials just went up in smoke. I have three runs on the ETs, and seven passes total. I can hardly wait to experience what a 1.6 feels like. What I can't tell you is my launch RPM. The distractions of a parachute car in the other lane is something I have to work on too.

94GT-T5 Fordstrokers DIY 347, TW190 FAC-Ported Victor EFI-FTI Cam-90mm LMAF-85MM TB-42s-LTs-4.10s QH tuned. 12.10 @119.50 NA.

Old combo- 306,AFR165,FTI,12.88 @108 NA, [email protected] on 100 shot.

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post #5 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 01:20 PM
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OK, get the PCV system checked out, then change the plugs and try it out. You can use a breather on the fill cap temporarily to keep pressure down until you get a new short block in there. 130 is a little low for compression. If its all of the cylinders then yeah the rings are probably wore out and need rebuilding. You can check the rings by doing a wet test. Put a little 10w30 in the hole through the spark plug hole and retest. If the numbers go up like 20-25% then your rings are wore out. If they don't you could have a head gasket, valve, or timing issue. If your are seeing a lot of crankcase pressure, yeah its probably the rings.

I recommend getting some 93 octane and setting your timing to around 32-34¬į total and leaving the spout out. I picked up around a tenth just in doing that. You'll probably want to change it back for normal driving.

If you end up at a test n tune lined up next to a very loud car, just let him go. Wait like a second or so then leave. Concentrate on the sound of the engine when its at the RPM you want. Later on you can get a shift light that will give you a good visual out of the corner of your eye on where you need to be. To get a 1.6x anything with that car you'll need to be balls to the wall on it. Like leaving at 5000+rpm WOT. IDK what kinda work you have done as far as subframe connectors, battery relocation, shocks, sway bar (removal), control arms. That stuff helps out a lot too. Get the weight out back, get the front up a little bit, and put weight on the rears. Remember, it takes traction to make traction
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post #6 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 01:40 PM
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btw, this is the light I use. You don't need some huge 9" tach on the dash. Its all relative to what the light says. If you set the light at 5200 shift and the tach reads 5800... then go off the light. With that cam you're probably not gonna want to shift much over 5000-5200.

http://www.raptorperformance.com/

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post #7 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 02:33 PM
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Oh... and start making a log of what changes you made and what your ET's were.

Something like this...

http://www.87gt.com/87GT/RACESHT2.xls
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post #8 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 03:09 PM
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i ran [email protected] 105.00 with a broke ring and compression low on every cylinder, stretched timing chain that was retarded 3 deg from the factory , 2.25 exhaust necked down to 2.00! so i think you rings are shot and the compresson is killing you !

93 hatch midnight blue 2710lbs 2890 with me
302 flipped stock trw's ,typhoon intake,70mm tb,gt40pheads,crane beehives,bbk lt,x-pipe,1chambers,safc,24lb inj,255 pump,76mm C&L,f-cam,4.30,t-5,king cobra clutch
best 1/4 time: 12.68 best 1/4 mph: 108.18

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post #9 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 04:02 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks again JD. My suspension is bone stock. I will set the the timing by your method. I am also installing a 190lph fuel pump this week. I'm skeered to spray it with my stock pump. What pressure would you recommend as a start? I was going to try 40#. I could certainly be wrong, but my car seems to pull a bit past 5200 rpm, even with the stock cam. I tried a pass with 5000 shifts and it was a full second slower. I'll let you know what happens soon. I'll be back at the track Friday night.

Boostjunkie, I'm not sure I am following what you said.

94GT-T5 Fordstrokers DIY 347, TW190 FAC-Ported Victor EFI-FTI Cam-90mm LMAF-85MM TB-42s-LTs-4.10s QH tuned. 12.10 @119.50 NA.

Old combo- 306,AFR165,FTI,12.88 @108 NA, [email protected] on 100 shot.
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post #10 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 04:22 PM
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The stock tachs in these cars are notoriously high. I shift at ~5200 and the stocker reads like 5800. You cannot rely on them to tell you where you need to shift. Really you need to get the car running right, get it on a dyno, and then set the shift light based on what the dyno says. At the least get an adjustable light like that raptor and ticker with it. My car seemed to run best at 39psi fuel, 34¬į timing (also ran good at 19¬į w/ spout), and the shift light set to 5100 (which means im shifting at 5300ish). It varies car to car... I also have 24# injectors. You have a stock cam so I would expect it to fall off pretty low (ie shift lower like 4900-5000 set on a shift light). You'll see huge power improvements with a cam and those heads/intake if you add it later on too.

Thanks for the PM... I guess other than that... you just need seat time. If you look at that race sheet I send you you may notice the red section went from like 13.20s @ 105 down to 12.30s @ 111. That second worth of ET is a result of only a tracloc rebuild and tinkering with the tire pressure, strange shock settings, fuel pressure, timing, shifting, launching. Have fun, figure this oil/power thing out, and put in some seat time...


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post #11 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 05:28 PM
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i just meant that my motor was wore out and still ran the times that it did ! your engine being tired could have alot to do with it.

93 hatch midnight blue 2710lbs 2890 with me
302 flipped stock trw's ,typhoon intake,70mm tb,gt40pheads,crane beehives,bbk lt,x-pipe,1chambers,safc,24lb inj,255 pump,76mm C&L,f-cam,4.30,t-5,king cobra clutch
best 1/4 time: 12.68 best 1/4 mph: 108.18
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post #12 of 15 Old 06-30-2008, 06:18 PM
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What's been said previously with regard to "tuning" and (especially) practice is absolutely true. With a little time and patience I'm sure you will see a good steady drop in your ET. Yes, keep a log book!

I just started 1/8 mi. this year, and I have gone from 9.4 down to 8.55. My only costly mods were a change from 3.55 to 4.10 gears and changing my stock converter to a 3000 stall. A good portion of ET reduction though has been due to little tuning changes and start-line experience. I race in Pacific Junction IA at Midamerica Motorplex, maybe I'll see you there sometime!

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....most of the guys in that site know what they're talking about.
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post #13 of 15 Old 07-06-2008, 08:32 AM Thread Starter
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Appreciate the help guys, and FWIW an update.

Didn't really do much. Installed a 190lph pump and played with the timing a bit as suggested. Feeling a more comfortable, and better able to stay focused on consistent driving.

Attended a "Midnight Mayhem" event intended for street cars. I saw no evidence of track prep, so launching was a new experience. I got spoiled last week with all the traction compound.

-My 60 foots no less than a full tenth slower on all runs.
-Had my 145# wife in the car for all five runs (no passenger last time)
-Still trimmed ETs from last week .15 faster on most runs (Now 14.41ET)
-Last run I tried a little NO2 50HP shot after 1-2 shift, then I missed third gear

Wife had a blast, saw the oil smoke in the rearview on the top end, and thinks we ought to spend some money on a shortblock and suspension. I'll call that a good night.

Thanks for all the help.

94GT-T5 Fordstrokers DIY 347, TW190 FAC-Ported Victor EFI-FTI Cam-90mm LMAF-85MM TB-42s-LTs-4.10s QH tuned. 12.10 @119.50 NA.

Old combo- 306,AFR165,FTI,12.88 @108 NA, [email protected] on 100 shot.
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post #14 of 15 Old 07-06-2008, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Stang D View Post

Wife had a blast, saw the oil smoke in the rearview on the top end, and thinks we ought to spend some money on a shortblock and suspension.
She's a keeper!
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post #15 of 15 Old 07-06-2008, 11:47 AM
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When the wife actually tells you to spend money on the car, you know you have a good one.

My wife bought me a new monster tach for our anniversary. That's why I've hung on to her for these past 31 years.

OFR - old fart racing

We're not fast racers. In fact folks call us half fast racers. At least I think that's what they're saying.
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