Why is Obama trying to wreck our economy ? - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
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post #1 of 93 Old 12-12-2015, 07:33 PM Thread Starter
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Thumbs down Why is Obama trying to wreck our economy ?

Since he signed the Iran nuclear deal which will not be approved by congress . He immediately lifted the sanctions on Iran which allowed them to sell oil on the world market. this glut has pushed prices down from $65/bbl to under $40/bbl and is about to put us into a great depression.
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post #2 of 93 Old 12-12-2015, 09:02 PM
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because he can? in order for him to fundamentally change the country to what he wants, he first has to bring down what we currently have. once that it done, supposedly the people will clamor for more change that obama wants, and force congress to give into what obama wants. its part of his idea that he is the one that will change the US into some kind of progressive utopia.

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post #3 of 93 Old 12-14-2015, 12:19 PM
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So did you say the same thing about Bush from 2005-2007 when the economy took a #### on us all? Or was that Obama's fault as well...

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post #4 of 93 Old 12-14-2015, 12:44 PM
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So did you say the same thing about Bush from 2005-2007 when the economy took a #### on us all? Or was that Obama's fault as well...
good call
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post #5 of 93 Old 12-14-2015, 06:59 PM
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Yeah because oil at $140/barrel and $5/gallon gas and $7/gallon diesel driving the prices on everything up will really get the American public out spending and kick the economy into high gear, derp.

This thread should be retitled: "Why does Lash post about things he has zero understanding of ?"
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post #6 of 93 Old 12-14-2015, 07:12 PM
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because he can? in order for him to fundamentally change the country to what he wants, he first has to bring down what we currently have. once that it done, supposedly the people will clamor for more change that obama wants, and force congress to give into what obama wants. its part of his idea that he is the one that will change the US into some kind of progressive utopia.
LOL @ "the people force congress to give into what obama wants"

Where do these people dig this stuff up ?
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post #7 of 93 Old 12-14-2015, 07:36 PM
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Since he signed the Iran nuclear deal which will not be approved by congress . He immediately lifted the sanctions on Iran which allowed them to sell oil on the world market. this glut has pushed prices down from $65/bbl to under $40/bbl and is about to put us into a great depression.
people think cheap gas is great! What they cant get through their thick skulls, is the flood of cheap oil from Iran is shutting down our oil fields here, Shell just laid off another 1,800 workers today, not to mention the ones they let go before which totals over 2,500 jobs just from 1 oil company! I live in an oil producing area of the country, and the economic ramifications are already showing. you people that sing the praises of the great "Obama" need your heads examined! Next you will be voting in Hillery so she can finish us off!
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post #8 of 93 Old 12-14-2015, 08:30 PM
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people think cheap gas is great! What they cant get through their thick skulls, is the flood of cheap oil from Iran is shutting down our oil fields here, Shell just laid off another 1,800 workers today, not to mention the ones they let go before which totals over 2,500 jobs just from 1 oil company! I live in an oil producing area of the country, and the economic ramifications are already showing. you people that sing the praises of the great "Obama" need your heads examined! Next you will be voting in Hillery so she can finish us off!
So you're saying that I and everyone else need to do our part by paying higher oil and gas prices and the resulting increased prices on other goods/services so that Shell or other oil companies can keep their employees ? You sound just like some liberal wanting OPM. Other peoples money.

The market is what it is. Not my responsibility to keep the oil companies at full employment anymore than its yours to keep my company from having to lay off people when higher gas prices kill off a bunch of my potential business. Jesus.
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post #9 of 93 Old 12-14-2015, 09:50 PM
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So did you say the same thing about Bush from 2005-2007 when the economy took a #### on us all? Or was that Obama's fault as well...
Even though the economy was on the downside in those years, many people believe that Obama is purposely trying to damage the American economy out of revenge for what he perceives as past social injustices. Whether that is actually true or not is impossible to prove. However, that notion is well fueled when he goes on record with comments such as one he made in Roanoke, VA in the 2012 presidental campaign where he made the claim that if you own a business, "You didn't build that, someone else did." Along with numerous other similar comments over the years.
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post #10 of 93 Old 12-15-2015, 11:10 AM
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Death by a thousand cuts.... And I'm not talking in the narrow scope of just oil, but more on the economy as a whole.

If he did allow Iranian oil in to hurt America intentionally, it would be to bankrupt the American oil industry.

Isn't it funny how the left not too long ago were trying to say we were going to run out of oil, blahh blahh, and now all of the sudden we're flooding in it?

Back to wrecking the economy....

See Cloward and Piven strategy on how to collapse the system and get their radical left-wing wet dream of a Marxist Socialist utopia. Well, some actually want Communism, too.

Read:

Quote:
The Cloward-Piven Strategy
By Richard Poe
DiscoverTheNetworks.org
2005


First proposed in 1966 and named after Columbia University sociologists Richard Andrew Cloward and Frances Fox Piven, the Cloward-Piven Strategy seeks to hasten the fall of capitalism by overloading the government bureaucracy with a flood of impossible demands, thus pushing society into crisis and economic collapse.

Inspired by the August 1965 riots in the black district of Watts in Los Angeles (which erupted after police had used batons to subdue an African American man suspected of drunk driving), Cloward and Piven published an article titled "The Weight of the Poor: A Strategy to End Poverty" in the May 2, 1966 issue of The Nation. Following its publication, The Nation sold an unprecedented 30,000 reprints. Activists were abuzz over the so-called "crisis strategy" or "Cloward-Piven Strategy," as it came to be called. Many were eager to put it into effect.

In their 1966 article, Cloward and Piven charged that the ruling classes used welfare to weaken the poor; that by providing a social safety net, the rich doused the fires of rebellion. Poor people can advance only when "the rest of society is afraid of them," Cloward told The New York Times on September 27, 1970. Rather than placating the poor with government hand-outs, wrote Cloward and Piven, activists should work to sabotage and destroy the welfare system; the collapse of the welfare state would ignite a political and financial crisis that would rock the nation; poor people would rise in revolt; only then would "the rest of society" accept their demands.

The key to sparking this rebellion would be to expose the inadequacy of the welfare state. Cloward-Piven's early promoters cited radical organizer Saul Alinsky as their inspiration. "Make the enemy live up to their (sic) own book of rules," Alinsky wrote in his 1971 book Rules for Radicals. When pressed to honor every word of every law and statute, every Judeo-Christian moral tenet, and every implicit promise of the liberal social contract, human agencies inevitably fall short. The system's failure to "live up" to its rule book can then be used to discredit it altogether, and to replace the capitalist "rule book" with a socialist one.

The authors noted that the number of Americans subsisting on welfare -- about 8 million, at the time -- probably represented less than half the number who were technically eligible for full benefits. They proposed a "massive drive to recruit the poor onto the welfare rolls." Cloward and Piven calculated that persuading even a fraction of potential welfare recipients to demand their entitlements would bankrupt the system. The result, they predicted, would be "a profound financial and political crisis" that would unleash "powerful forces for major economic reform at the national level."

Their article called for "cadres of aggressive organizers" to use "demonstrations to create a climate of militancy." Intimidated by threats of black violence, politicians would appeal to the federal government for help. Carefully orchestrated media campaigns, carried out by friendly, leftwing journalists, would float the idea of "a federal program of income redistribution," in the form of a guaranteed living income for all -- working and non-working people alike. Local officials would clutch at this idea like drowning men to a lifeline. They would apply pressure on Washington to implement it. With every major city erupting into chaos, Washington would have to act. This was an example of what are commonly called Trojan Horse movements -- mass movements whose outward purpose seems to be providing material help to the downtrodden, but whose real objective is to draft poor people into service as revolutionary foot soldiers; to mobilize poor people en masse to overwhelm government agencies with a flood of demands beyond the capacity of those agencies to meet. The flood of demands was calculated to break the budget, jam the bureaucratic gears into gridlock, and bring the system crashing down. Fear, turmoil, violence and economic collapse would accompany such a breakdown -- providing perfect conditions for fostering radical change. That was the theory.

Cloward and Piven recruited a militant black organizer named George Wiley to lead their new movement. In the summer of 1967, Wiley founded the National Welfare Rights Organization (NWRO). His tactics closely followed the recommendations set out in Cloward and Piven's article. His followers invaded welfare offices across the United States -- often violently -- bullying social workers and loudly demanding every penny to which the law "entitled" them. By 1969, NWRO claimed a dues-paying membership of 22,500 families, with 523 chapters across the nation.

Regarding Wiley's tactics, The New York Times commented on September 27, 1970, "There have been sit-ins in legislative chambers, including a United States Senate committee hearing, mass demonstrations of several thousand welfare recipients, school boycotts, picket lines, mounted police, tear gas, arrests - and, on occasion, rock-throwing, smashed glass doors, overturned desks, scattered papers and ripped-out phones."These methods proved effective. "The flooding succeeded beyond Wiley's wildest dreams," writes Sol Stern in the City Journal. "From 1965 to 1974, the number of single-parent households on welfare soared from 4.3 million to 10.8 million, despite mostly flush economic times. By the early 1970s, one person was on the welfare rolls in New York City for every two working in the city's private economy." As a direct result of its massive welfare spending, New York City was forced to declare bankruptcy in 1975. The entire state of New York nearly went down with it. The Cloward-Piven strategy had proved its effectiveness.
The Cloward-Piven strategy depended on surprise. Once society recovered from the initial shock, the backlash began. New York's welfare crisis horrified America, giving rise to a reform movement which culminated in "the end of welfare as we know it" -- the 1996 Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Reconciliation Act, which imposed time limits on federal welfare, along with strict eligibility and work requirements. Both Cloward and Piven attended the White House signing of the bill as guests of President Clinton.

Most Americans to this day have never heard of Cloward and Piven. But New York City Mayor Rudolph Giuliani attempted to expose them in the late 1990s. As his drive for welfare reform gained momentum, Giuliani accused the militant scholars by name, citing their 1966 manifesto as evidence that they had engaged in deliberate economic sabotage. "This wasn't an accident," Giuliani charged in a 1997 speech. "It wasn't an atmospheric thing, it wasn't supernatural. This is the result of policies and programs designed to have the maximum number of people get on welfare."

Cloward and Piven never again revealed their intentions as candidly as they had in their 1966 article. Even so, their activism in subsequent years continued to rely on the tactic of overloading the system. When the public caught on to their welfare scheme, Cloward and Piven simply moved on, applying pressure to other sectors of the bureaucracy, wherever they detected weakness.

In 1982, partisans of the Cloward-Piven strategy founded a new "voting rights movement," which purported to take up the unfinished work of the Voting Rights Act of 1965. Like ACORN, the organization that spear-headed this campaign, the new "voting rights" movement was led by veterans of George Wiley's welfare rights crusade. Its flagship organizations were Project Vote and Human SERVE, both founded in 1982. Project Vote is an ACORN front group, launched by former NWRO organizer and ACORN co-founder Zach Polett. Human SERVE was founded by Richard A. Cloward and Frances Fox Piven, along with a former NWRO organizer named Hulbert James.

All three of these organizations -- ACORN, Project Vote and Human SERVE -- set to work lobbying energetically for the so-called Motor-Voter law, which Bill Clinton ultimately signed in 1993. The Motor-Voter bill is largely responsible for swamping the voter rolls with "dead wood" -- invalid registrations signed in the name of deceased, ineligible or non-existent people -- thus opening the door to the unprecedented levels of voter fraud and "voter disenfranchisement" claims that followed in subsequent elections.

The new "voting rights" coalition combines mass voter registration drives -- typically featuring high levels of fraud -- with systematic intimidation of election officials in the form of frivolous lawsuits, unfounded charges of "racism" and "disenfranchisement," and "direct action" (street protests, violent or otherwise). Just as they swamped America's welfare offices in the 1960s, Cloward-Piven devotees now seek to overwhelm the nation's understaffed and poorly policed electoral system. Their tactics set the stage for the Florida recount crisis of 2000, and have introduced a level of fear, tension and foreboding to U.S. elections heretofore encountered mainly in Third World countries.

Both the Living Wage and Voting Rights movements depend heavily on financial support from George Soros's Open Society Institute and his Shadow Party, through whose support the Cloward-Piven strategy continues to provide a blueprint for some of the Left's most ambitious campaigns.

http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/A...rategypoe.html
Frances Fox Piven: Frances Fox Piven - Discover the Networks

Richard A. Cloward: Richard A. Cloward - KeyWiki

Home cpusa and Communist Party USA (CPUSA) - Discover the Networks and Communist Party USA - KeyWiki
Democratic Socialists of America and Democratic Socialists of America (DSA) - Discover the Networks and Democratic Socialists of America - KeyWiki

Major billionaire funder of left-wing orgs, Soros: George Soros - Discover the Networks and George Soros - KeyWiki
Orgs funded by Soros: Discover the Networks and Organizations Funded by George Soros and His Open Society Institute - Discover the Networks and Open Society Institute - KeyWiki
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post #11 of 93 Old 12-15-2015, 12:24 PM
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This is a very funny topic because the person who started it and anyone who agrees with it has no idea how our economy runs these days.
First thing I will say is take a look at oil prices and business cycles in history. Rising oil prices almost always contribute to the downturn of the economy. See chart.
Second drop in oil prices leads to more money in the vast majority of peoples pockets.
Example - I was looking for the chart on pony car sales for this...I think it was on the other forum. But if you look at the price of gas the amount of sports cars sold is inversely correlated.
Also if you look at the structure of jobs in the US.
Employment by major industry sector
You have mining 523.2K .. I believe within that number are the oil company jobs...I know the total to be around 200K. The impact of oil jobs is INSIGNIFICANT on the US economy. We have had job growth of more than 200K for some time now on average. See second chart...you can average it out let you numbskulls do a little math. Should be pretty close to 200k which is the TOTAL employment of the oil industry.
So what that all means to sum it up for you...if gas prices put 100 bucks a month in the average consumer pockets they will spend it .. on what ...the biggest thing in our economy is services. Which increases production which continues to fuel our economy.
Lower oil prices = better overall economy.
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post #12 of 93 Old 12-15-2015, 07:09 PM
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What ultimately dictates how well the economy is performing is the take home pay for working Americans. That number has decreased since 1999.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Househ..._United_States
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post #13 of 93 Old 12-15-2015, 10:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5.8 TurboCoupe View Post
LOL @ "the people force congress to give into what obama wants"

Where do these people dig this stuff up ?
try a little reading comprehension, and reread what i wrote.

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post #14 of 93 Old 12-16-2015, 02:52 AM
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try a little reading comprehension, and reread what i wrote.
Sounded as idiotic on the second read as it did on the first, chief. If you and Lash want to post up a bunch of fantasy condemnations of Obama and drag them in here to get laughed at, be my guest. But there is plenty to criticize based on fact. Try sticking with that.
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post #15 of 93 Old 12-16-2015, 04:07 AM
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Sounded as idiotic on the second read as it did on the first, chief. If you and Lash want to post up a bunch of fantasy condemnations of Obama and drag them in here to get laughed at, be my guest. But there is plenty to criticize based on fact. Try sticking with that.
in other words you suck at reading comprehension and need to take a course in that subject.

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post #16 of 93 Old 12-16-2015, 09:30 AM
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in other words you suck at reading comprehension and need to take a course in that subject.
So you made an idiotic post like the OP did and are going to keep trying to run away from it by deflecting to reading comprehension. Which you havent got a case for. Keep swingin chief, eventually you'll hit something. Or not.
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post #17 of 93 Old 12-16-2015, 10:04 AM
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What ultimately dictates how well the economy is performing is the take home pay for working Americans. That number has decreased since 1999.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Househ..._United_States

So you agree with me as the price of oil decreases you get a downward pressure on inflation which increases real wages.
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post #18 of 93 Old 12-16-2015, 03:36 PM
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Isn't this a reflection of a true free market? We are being forced to compete, we simply can't at this point in time. So the oil companies, who are very concerned about their financial backing (stock owners) think because we can't compete right now, we need to lay off workers to stop some of the bleeding. That way we can still turn a good enough profit share that we can still have that financial backing and maybe if we come up with a way to compete we can hire people back.
We all have our niche. 30-40 years ago, the niches were different. some disappeared altogether and new ones were created. This is the same thing. We are being forced out of our comfort zones and being pushed to find new ways of making money and being useful to the world.
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Yes that is true for sure. Growing up my family worked in the steel mills in Pittsburgh.
The US Steel building which dominated downtown PGH is now the headquarters of a hospital. You can still find steel in PGH but is specialty steel for the most part.
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post #20 of 93 Old 12-18-2015, 08:25 PM
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if you guy actually read this stuff, it is not the USA vs Iran, this is the result of all the nations that negotiated this deal. France germany, great britain, etc. the economy is better now than in the last 10 yrs. the republicans have control in congress and vote down everything that comes to them be it good or bad. just be glad Romney didn't win. he wouldn't have bailed out the big three, he was going to eliminate the EPA(so companies could pollute us to death). supported the demise of the middle class. we buy the cars, cycles, houses,boats, summer cottages,etc. he was going to let our employers drop our pensions. obama car isn't the greatest but it's a start at what they've been working on since the 1950's. alot of people got sucked into the housing market *uckup. you know you couldn't afford a 250,000 home but did it anyway. I know people who did it, wife worked at Kmart, him at Chrysler. she lost her management job when Kmart merged with Sears. this was the beginning of the recession. we didn't get overtime for months, they lost their house. gas is cheap now, so all the reasons for the high gas prices were lies! Both Bush's started wars that drained money from the state revenue sharing. Bush had a war to pay for so the fed stopped sending money to the states, cancelling programs like the focus hope machining program. school districts you thought were doing good needed millages past to keep them going. this has been happening since the Bush administration. all this mess was inherited. put blame where it's deserved.

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post #21 of 93 Old 12-18-2015, 08:43 PM
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as far as wages decreasing since 1999. I made more per hour every yr. the overtime did go down but I always saw that extra money. some seen as regular wages. I made dam good money during those yrs. spent lots on a mustang,RV,boat. on two kids. you better hope Trump doesn't get in there. He's too brash and would do things that will hurt the US like offending leaders of ther countries due to his big mouth! the goverment has been trying to take some of our gun rights for yrs(both repub and dem) the country is made up of every nationality. the mouslim thing now is very bad, but the goverment has spies everywhere in the world. they know #### is comming and won't let other agencies know. enough rambling

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post #22 of 93 Old 12-19-2015, 04:09 AM
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Low oil prices equal more car truck sales. The auto companies have created more jobs than what will be lost in oil sector. Just like when auto sector was crumbling because of high fuel prices. The oil and gas industry was booming. Not sure where the happy medium will end up at. But I hope the fracking industry will be a hedge against high oil prices. We proved we can do it but its recovery cost is just to high to make money right now.


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post #23 of 93 Old 12-21-2015, 01:26 PM
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Gas prices are high: "Obama hates America and is trying to cripple the oil industry, wreck the economy, and bring about his communist utopia at the behest of his pals in the Middle East!"

Gas prices are low: "Obama hates America and is trying to cripple the oil industry, wreck the economy, and bring about his communist utopia at the behest of his pals in the Middle East!"

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I still find it amusing that people think one political party is inherently good and the other is inherently bad. They have bought hook, line, and sinker into one party's propaganda machine (whether it be Republican or Democrat). When people think that their party is golden and the other is bad they fail to see that both parties, in reality, don't care about the common American. Both parties are in the pockets of large corporations and Wall Street. So instead of quibbling about things that have no effect on your personal life (gay marriage, how much and what kind of religion is allowed in other people's lives) maybe we should try to take back the government from corporations so we can all have a voice in economic issues that affect us all.

Arguing that your political party is better is apparently easier and makes one feel better however......

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post #25 of 93 Old 12-22-2015, 08:25 PM
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All I can say is my pay is nothing now since Obama Care kicked in. As of next year, my health benefits are up 400% more than 2 years ago.

Lower gas prices alone are not a reason to claim that there is no inflation. I must be one of the lucky ones who doesn't have that career that gives merit raises along with cost of living increases occasionally.

But it doesn't help that I live in the crappiest state in the US as well. My fault so I need to move elsewhere.
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post #26 of 93 Old 12-25-2015, 01:32 PM Thread Starter
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Tax and spend democrats is not a term invented by GOP or is conservative republican . I see some of you are trying to justify voting for the wrong guy not once but twice ...

NOT DRIVING YOUR CAR TO KEEP THE MILEAGE LOW IS LIKE SAVING YOUR WIFE FOR THE NEXT GUY
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post #27 of 93 Old 12-25-2015, 09:03 PM
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Tax and spend democrats is not a term invented by GOP or is conservative republican . I see some of you are trying to justify voting for the wrong guy not once but twice ...
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post #28 of 93 Old 12-25-2015, 09:56 PM
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you are so right
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post #29 of 93 Old 12-28-2015, 04:10 PM Thread Starter
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I consider the source ....Sometimes I think your are naysayer , yours posts are so much like his ...

NOT DRIVING YOUR CAR TO KEEP THE MILEAGE LOW IS LIKE SAVING YOUR WIFE FOR THE NEXT GUY
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post #30 of 93 Old 12-28-2015, 04:29 PM
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if you guy actually read this stuff, it is not the USA vs Iran, this is the result of all the nations that negotiated this deal. France germany, great britain, etc. the economy is better now than in the last 10 yrs. the republicans have control in congress and vote down everything that comes to them be it good or bad. just be glad Romney didn't win. he wouldn't have bailed out the big three, he was going to eliminate the EPA(so companies could pollute us to death). supported the demise of the middle class. we buy the cars, cycles, houses,boats, summer cottages,etc. he was going to let our employers drop our pensions. obama car isn't the greatest but it's a start at what they've been working on since the 1950's. alot of people got sucked into the housing market *uckup. you know you couldn't afford a 250,000 home but did it anyway. I know people who did it, wife worked at Kmart, him at Chrysler. she lost her management job when Kmart merged with Sears. this was the beginning of the recession. we didn't get overtime for months, they lost their house. gas is cheap now, so all the reasons for the high gas prices were lies! Both Bush's started wars that drained money from the state revenue sharing. Bush had a war to pay for so the fed stopped sending money to the states, cancelling programs like the focus hope machining program. school districts you thought were doing good needed millages past to keep them going. this has been happening since the Bush administration. all this mess was inherited. put blame where it's deserved.
Obama campaigned on no more corporate Welfare, he was not going to bail out those two loser car companies either. But he did because the UAW gave him millions for his campaign and would give millions more to the DNC if it was ok with Obama to screw the taxpayers out of about $13B. As long as it was used to bail out some commie union, how could Obama say no?

The ACA has been terrible to many people I know. More cost, less benefits and services; not much of a success unless you are one of those that never had insurance and just rode the backs of others.

Who knows what Romney would have done, Obama sure changed when he supported Corporate, er, Commie welfare by going against his promise and bailing out two terrible car companies we didn't need.

Iran's oil, people seem to forget that China has dramatically slowed its economy. That has also had a negative impact on the oil market. Just today I heard that SUVs were one of the 2015 sales leaders. Seems Obama is also letting companies "pollute us to death".

So, I suppose it all depends upon your view, but to me Obama has been just as bad for the average taxpayer as anyone before him.


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post #31 of 93 Old 12-29-2015, 08:45 AM
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Who produces the most oil globally? Is the US really the one feeling the pain on this one? You want Daesh getting $120 a barrel for their oil?

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post #32 of 93 Old 12-29-2015, 08:55 AM
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No matter what happens blame President Obama.
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post #33 of 93 Old 12-29-2015, 01:11 PM
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Obama campaigned on no more corporate Welfare, he was not going to bail out those two loser car companies either. But he did because the UAW gave him millions for his campaign and would give millions more to the DNC if it was ok with Obama to screw the taxpayers out of about $13B. As long as it was used to bail out some commie union, how could Obama say no?
The Bush Administration gave General Motors over $13 billion in TARP funds before Obama's moving van had pulled up to the White House. I'm not trying to suggest either one was more innocent than the other here, but it seems disingenuous to omit this information given the context.
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post #34 of 93 Old 12-29-2015, 01:45 PM
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Oil companies in USA will be closed because of Unions. Uneducated workers make $60-100k a year out there doing grunt work. If the oil companies could pay grunt wages for grunt work operating costs would not be so high, but Unions fix that. Either the rich get richer on the backs of the poor, or the poor get paid so much that rich go down with them. No matter what, someone is going to be the loser in an economic system. Get used to it, someone is always going to be getting the shaft as long as ANY one is in the White House (and maybe we get screwed more when no one is in the White House) Point is get used to getting screwed.

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post #35 of 93 Old 12-30-2015, 11:17 AM
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The Bush Administration gave General Motors over $13 billion in TARP funds before Obama's moving van had pulled up to the White House. I'm not trying to suggest either one was more innocent than the other here, but it seems disingenuous to omit this information given the context.
Just showing a practical illustration that what the candidate campaigns upon is not always what happens.

Either way, Obama promised no corporate welfare and then did just that. He also promised us a 'profit' on the UAW/GM/Chrysler investment. Still waiting on that money, likely will forever. Two horrible companies saved and the taxpayers holding the bag.


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