Longtubes for sn95 351w swap - Ford Mustang Forums : Corral.net Mustang Forum
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post #1 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 02:29 PM Thread Starter
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Longtubes for sn95 351w swap

I have a 94 gt 5 speed I'm putting a 351w in. First thing is going to long tubes really that much more beneficial? And if it is is there a company that offers 351w swap longtubes for an sn95? Not kooks can't afford them right now

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post #2 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 04:50 PM
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I have a 94 gt 5 speed I'm putting a 351w in. First thing is going to long tubes really that much more beneficial? And if it is is there a company that offers 351w swap longtubes for an sn95? Not kooks can't afford them right now
I'm going to do the same thing but lately have decided to go ahead and build the 331 first, then get another car and do the 351(400 W). My research has led me to the BBK 1 3/4 ceramic coated LT's. I've always heard that the tone of the engine with the LT's different and in most cases there is a hp gain but maybe not night and day. There may be some ground clearance issues as well if the car is lowered. I've read enough to where I'm going to go ahead and get them with the 351 and should have fine ground clearance and such.


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post #3 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 04:53 PM Thread Starter
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Are you talking about the regular bbk long tubes or the bbk 351w swap long tubes?
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Are you talking about the regular bbk long tubes or the bbk 351w swap long tubes?
the fox 351 swap LTs.

American muscle has them for $549

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post #5 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 05:06 PM Thread Starter
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They will swap right into my 94 mustang with a 351w without any issues?
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post #6 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 05:26 PM
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They will swap right into my 94 mustang with a 351w without any issues?
Man I did some reading and researching and some have had to do some massaging of some things just depending on their setup and such, rather they went with an aftermarket K member, ect. I haven't done mine yet but I've found it best after talking to folks who have done it, I mean Pming them, emailing them, some I've called on the phone and even some shops.

Basically what I've found best for our cars is to go with the tremec tranny and get the setup to use the fox bell, fox clutch fork, and something else. it will make things much easier for fitment vs using the T5 or A5 stock tranny. My reading up have led me to read where guys using the stock tranny with LT's had other issues that they had to work out. I forgot what some were but just google 351 swaps in SN95 and read up man. I learned a lot and jotted down a lot of notes.

So basically that's the route I'm going to go even if it's going to cost more overall. My motto is do it once and do it right. Try to aviod as must PITA situations as ya can
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post #7 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 07:09 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you that helps a ton lol I feel like I've seen you comment on other posts about this. I won't be going with an aftermarket k member and I'm keeping my t5 in. What do you mean the fox clutch fork setup? And what about the steering shaft? I read that was an issue. And if the bbk 351w swap headers work then won't the mac and other swap ones work as well?
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post #8 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 07:15 PM
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Thank you that helps a ton lol I feel like I've seen you comment on other posts about this. I won't be going with an aftermarket k member and I'm keeping my t5 in. What do you mean the fox clutch fork setup? And what about the steering shaft? I read that was an issue. And if the bbk 351w swap headers work then won't the mac and other swap ones work as well?
There's a place called Hanlon Motorsports a guy named Bob helped me out a lot when I called and talked to him and told him what I was doing he was telling me about the fitment issues and stuff like that. Some of the guys have steering shaft issues where they had to I forgot exactly what they did some have to bend or beat the Heather a little bit where it hit to clear it. Using the T5 there something about and reference to where the transmission will be and be very close to something I forgot what it was so there's a clearance issue right there too. The only there are not many 351 headers for the sn95 actually you have to use the 351 Fox swap headers so you going to have to use a fox while Peter for the 351. You may be able to use the T5 with that setup but like I said the gist of the problems is everything lining up and stuff like that. It's better if you call Bob at Hanlon Motorsports and he can tell you more about it. There's also a guy and I have his phone number you can call and ask him he will and like me you a little bit also. Like I said I have not done mine yet so it's hard for me to remember exactly all the details I just know it was enough for me to take heed to what they were saying me to take heed to what they were saying. I've learned from a long time to go when I first started no need to pinch pennies if you have to save up and do it right try to avoid the issues the first time.

When using the Tremec transmission you have to use when you use the Tremec Transmission in the fox swap headers you'll have to use the fox bellhousing clutch for an order for everything to match correctly I don't believe you can use well put it like that she was in the trim it tranny will be much easier for placement everything and that's what block Bob will explain when using the Trimec you have to use the Fox Barrel I believe I don't think you can match it up any other way from what I understood if I recall correctly
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post #9 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 07:19 PM
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Excuse the speech to text LOL oh. And at the only long tube headers they make for a 351 swap are the fox swap headers other than that I know cooks and accufab should have them or can custom make some for the 351 swap
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post #10 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 10:19 PM
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longtubes are dead

stop wasting time on them


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longtubes are dead

stop wasting time on them
lol doing my 331 I'm going to re-use my shorties but with the 408 I'll go with Longtubes.

I'll have 2 cars with different setups so it's all good.

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post #12 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 10:48 PM Thread Starter
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longtubes are dead

stop wasting time on them
Why do you say that? Should I just go with shorties then?
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post #13 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 10:52 PM Thread Starter
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There's a place called Hanlon Motorsports a guy named Bob helped me out a lot when I called and talked to him and told him what I was doing he was telling me about the fitment issues and stuff like that. Some of the guys have steering shaft issues where they had to I forgot exactly what they did some have to bend or beat the Heather a little bit where it hit to clear it. Using the T5 there something about and reference to where the transmission will be and be very close to something I forgot what it was so there's a clearance issue right there too. The only there are not many 351 headers for the sn95 actually you have to use the 351 Fox swap headers so you going to have to use a fox while Peter for the 351. You may be able to use the T5 with that setup but like I said the gist of the problems is everything lining up and stuff like that. It's better if you call Bob at Hanlon Motorsports and he can tell you more about it. There's also a guy and I have his phone number you can call and ask him he will and like me you a little bit also. Like I said I have not done mine yet so it's hard for me to remember exactly all the details I just know it was enough for me to take heed to what they were saying me to take heed to what they were saying. I've learned from a long time to go when I first started no need to pinch pennies if you have to save up and do it right try to avoid the issues the first time.

When using the Tremec transmission you have to use when you use the Tremec Transmission in the fox swap headers you'll have to use the fox bellhousing clutch for an order for everything to match correctly I don't believe you can use well put it like that she was in the trim it tranny will be much easier for placement everything and that's what block Bob will explain when using the Trimec you have to use the Fox Barrel I believe I don't think you can match it up any other way from what I understood if I recall correctly
Thanks for the info! So if I keep the t5 I'll have to get a fox bell housing and clutch for to make it fit? And maybe bend the primary by the steering shaft? I don't get how there isn't much more concrete info on this surely thousands have done a 351w In a sn95. Maybe they just say #### it and use the shorties lol. That would be nice since I then won't have to buy another h pipe
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post #14 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 10:52 PM
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longtubes are dead

stop wasting time on them
Why do you say that? Should I just go with shorties then?
Man no offense but you will learn a lot if you start googling asking questions in the search browser and it will take you to many farms where you can see a lot of topics a lot of old discussion about certain things and just read them and that's how I learned a lot. I mean yeah basically a lot of folks say there are not a lot of differences between the Shorties and the long tubes over the different Power Band with a different set up sometimes the same setups with just swapping the two items. And so some theater not to have a headache up if you have a lowered car with the scraping issue or whatever the case is some people just go with the shortest what you know
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post #15 of 48 Old 04-20-2017, 11:07 PM
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Should I just go with shorties then?
yes

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post #16 of 48 Old 04-21-2017, 06:56 AM
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BTW, the difference between FOX and SN transmissions is the clutch fork positions.
That's an interference issue for some.

MAC also makes a 351 longtube header, fyi

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BTW, the difference between FOX and SN transmissions is the clutch fork positions.
That's an interference issue for some.

MAC also makes a 351 longtube header, fyi
yes I remember those points being made when talking to folks also.

forgot that Mac did too

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post #18 of 48 Old 04-22-2017, 01:49 PM
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Hooker headers 6223 fit, that's what I'm running in my 94.

Long tubes can make a remarkable difference over shorties, but different engines will respond differently.

In my own car my fuel was dialed in before I made the change, and after the change the engine was getting so much more fresh air in to the chamber that there were several areas while driving where I would bury the needle lean on my wideband.

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Hooker headers 6223 fit, that's what I'm running in my 94.

Long tubes can make a remarkable difference over shorties, but different engines will respond differently.

In my own car my fuel was dialed in before I made the change, and after the change the engine was getting so much more fresh air in to the chamber that there were several areas while driving where I would bury the needle lean on my wideband.
THANK you for that info! do you have clearances issues with the long tubes? Is your car lowered. My 94 is stock height right now. I can go off roading with it hahah
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post #20 of 48 Old 04-22-2017, 02:11 PM
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THANK you for that info! do you have clearances issues with the long tubes? Is your car lowered. My 94 is stock height right now. I can go off roading with it hahah
No clearance issues but I want to say I do have the clutch fork in the fox position. I'm not 100% sure on that. I will check it out and verify one way or the other.

My car is pretty low. Ground clearance is not a problem. My engine is set down a little. If you have stock motor mounts you might need to massage the floor pans a bit for the collector flanges, but frankly that's a way better issue to solve than ground clearance IMO.

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Hooker headers 6223 fit, that's what I'm running in my 94.

Long tubes can make a remarkable difference over shorties, but different engines will respond differently.

In my own car my fuel was dialed in before I made the change, and after the change the engine was getting so much more fresh air in to the chamber that there were several areas while driving where I would bury the needle lean on my wideband.
The only reason I will use my shorties from the 302 is because I'm going to do 3 cars and even for the 331, I'll just use the shorties. Now as for the 95 400 W and the Terminator, It'll be longtubes.

Just checked and the ceramic hookers you mentioned are 400 bucks more than the bbk ceramics. Damn, $940.00 lol

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THANK you for that info! do you have clearances issues with the long tubes? Is your car lowered. My 94 is stock height right now. I can go off roading with it hahah
seems like they are 400 bucks more than the bbk ceramics

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No clearance issues but I want to say I do have the clutch fork in the fox position. I'm not 100% sure on that. I will check it out and verify one way or the other.

My car is pretty low. Ground clearance is not a problem. My engine is set down a little. If you have stock motor mounts you might need to massage the floor pans a bit for the collector flanges, but frankly that's a way better issue to solve than ground clearance IMO.
That's why I just will bite the bullet when it comes to the 400W and just get a TKO 600 since I'm expecting around 500 hp to the wheels. A T5 or even an A5, both built, from what I've gathered won't necessarily hold up though my car won't be a track car, I'm just going to go with the TKO. Another thing is after talking to a few guys who spent so much money upgrading the the A5 and T5 that he could have just went ahead and bought the T56 Magnum which he ended up getting after breaking the others.

Also, Bob from Hanlon motorsports we had a long conversation , after talking to the guy with the 95 and him telling me how the tremec and using the fox setup made aligning everything easier and smoother. Bob said indeed I'd need to use the Fox bell and clutch fork, and a few other minor things. So yes that's the route I'm going with the 400W. Shorties since I have them on my 302, will go with the 331 more than likely unless I change my mind

I already have the x pipe and everything for the shorties so...........

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post #24 of 48 Old 04-23-2017, 10:37 AM
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I do have the fox bell housing setup. I'm pretty sure the hookers would not work with the 94/95 clutch fork but I'm also pretty sure that's the only reason they aren't listed to work with 94/95 cars.
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I do have the fox bell housing setup. I'm pretty sure the hookers would not work with the 94/95 clutch fork but I'm also pretty sure that's the only reason they aren't listed to work with 94/95 cars.
Yeah from what I've been told and read there are not a lot of options for the 94 95 other than the fox swap headers. Unless there are maybe some companies that do custom stuff
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post #26 of 48 Old 04-23-2017, 10:46 AM
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Just checked and the ceramic hookers you mentioned are 400 bucks more than the bbk ceramics. Damn, $940.00 lol
True. I got mine used so the cost was comparable. Just gotta figure out what makes sense for you. The differences with the BBK is that you're giving up a little bit in a couple of areas. How much that matters is debatable I'm sure.

They use a ball and socket flange. The primaries are not equal lengths. They do not work with "big" heads that use a diagonal bolt pattern on the exhaust. But if big heads aren't in the future I expect the flange difference and unequal primaries really won't matter.

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Just checked and the ceramic hookers you mentioned are 400 bucks more than the bbk ceramics. Damn, $940.00 lol
True. I got mine used so the cost was comparable. Just gotta figure out what makes sense for you. The differences with the BBK is that you're giving up a little bit in a couple of areas. How much that matters is debatable I'm sure.

They use a ball and socket flange. The primaries are not equal lengths. They do not work with "big" heads that use a diagonal bolt pattern on the exhaust. But if big heads aren't in the future I expect the flange difference and unequal primaries really won't matter.
Well I'm either more than likely going to go with the AFR 205 or the TF 11 R so I need to research rather they will work with those heads unless you know the answer?
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Well I'm either more than likely going to go with the AFR 205 or the TF 11 R so I need to research rather they will work with those heads unless you know the answer?
At a glance neither use the diagonal exhaust pattern so the hookers would not be the right headers for you. The AFRs appear to have the stock width and then a 2nd set of wider positions. If you use those I would take advantage of the wider positions and have the heads ported but that means the BBKs won't work. The Trick flow only has 1 set of mounts, I don't know if that's stock width or not. If not the BBKs won't work.

Welcome to trying to make all the aftermarket junk work together.

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post #29 of 48 Old 04-23-2017, 12:00 PM Thread Starter
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I do have the fox bell housing setup. I'm pretty sure the hookers would not work with the 94/95 clutch fork but I'm also pretty sure that's the only reason they aren't listed to work with 94/95 cars.
Can I use my t5 with the fox bellhousing swap and clutch fork and work? Or do I need a new trans plus the fox bellhousing and clutch fork? Cause I can get a fox bell and fork no problem. It I'm not buying a new trans now for a header clearance issue haha
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post #30 of 48 Old 04-23-2017, 12:14 PM
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Well I'm either more than likely going to go with the AFR 205 or the TF 11 R so I need to research rather they will work with those heads unless you know the answer?
At a glance neither use the diagonal exhaust pattern so the hookers would not be the right headers for you. The AFRs appear to have the stock width and then a 2nd set of wider positions. If you use those I would take advantage of the wider positions and have the heads ported but that means the BBKs won't work. The Trick flow only has 1 set of mounts, I don't know if that's stock width or not. If not the BBKs won't work.

Welcome to trying to make all the aftermarket junk work together.
Oh okay I thought you were referring to using the BBk I had to find a head that had those diagonal pattern. Yeah now got to dig a little more to find out which headers or if there are certain heads that I have to get now to match up with the Bbk or if not then which headers will work with one of those two heads..

Dang......
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post #31 of 48 Old 04-23-2017, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by seijirou View Post
I do have the fox bell housing setup. I'm pretty sure the hookers would not work with the 94/95 clutch fork but I'm also pretty sure that's the only reason they aren't listed to work with 94/95 cars.
Can I use my t5 with the fox bellhousing swap and clutch fork and work? Or do I need a new trans plus the fox bellhousing and clutch fork? Cause I can get a fox bell and fork no problem. It I'm not buying a new trans now for a header clearance issue haha
You said you are building a 351. You do realize that Transmissions R rated up to a certain amount of horsepower and torque right? As far as I no the two fires are good up to 300 foot pounds of torque which with the 351 you will have much more than that. I may for the 331 I may just use my T5 and see how long it lasts even though I don't plan on tracking the car or power shifting and all that crazy stuff really to be honest not drastic anyway but if that doesn't work then I will go ahead and decide what to get next for it. As for the 400 Windsor it will get a TKO 600
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post #32 of 48 Old 04-23-2017, 12:21 PM
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T5s I meant
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post #33 of 48 Old 04-23-2017, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Oh.my.5.0 View Post
Can I use my t5 with the fox bellhousing swap and clutch fork and work? Or do I need a new trans plus the fox bellhousing and clutch fork? Cause I can get a fox bell and fork no problem. It I'm not buying a new trans now for a header clearance issue haha
The input shaft is longer on the sn95 t-5, so you can't just swap the bell housing

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post #34 of 48 Old 04-23-2017, 12:26 PM
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Call Tony at Astro performance and relay to him about you wanting to use that transmission for the 351. I just talked to Tony this past Thursday and he explained that to me about buying a new T5 Z spec that they have and he would have to change out some things on it the input shaft I believe what they have some pieces of specifically that would make it work but you would need to call him and let him break it down to you
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post #35 of 48 Old 04-23-2017, 12:27 PM Thread Starter
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Damn so this show bell housing thing is basically swapping trans to get some damn lt to fit lol. Maybe I'll just go shorties...
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