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Another 'Which cam with this combo?' question.

800 views 21 replies 6 participants last post by  TOM89LX50 
#1 ·
The Combo as of now:

-AFR 165's, -1.7 Cobra RR's, -Stock '86 HO cam, -Stock Ported Intake(flows 265 CFM), -65mm FMS TB, -70mm FMS MAF, -BBK CAI, -24lb FMS Injectors, -Underdrive Pullies, -LongTubes, -Catless H-Pipe, -2 1/2 Inch Flowmasters, -3.73 rear gear, -AOD w/ 9.5" Lockup Edge Converter w/ 3000 stall, -Transgo Shift Kit

The two cams I've narrowed it down to:

Anderson N-41 Specs at .050: LCA 110, ICL 106, 222/230 dur, 512/512 lift, BTDC 5, ABDC 37, BBDC 49, ATDC 1

Lunati 5.0 Blue Racer 51028 Specs at .050: LCA 111, ICL 106, 221/232 dur, 526/530 lift, BTDC 4.5, ABDC 36.5, BBDC 52, ATDC 0

According to the Desktop Dyno 2000, they make the exact same power in the exact same places. They cost the same too. Also, as of now, I get 19 MPG in the City, and 24 MPG on the Freeway. That being said, I want the cam which will have the best driveablility with the stock computer and 4.10's(I will be switching to 4.10's).

Which should I go with, and why? How much do you think my mileage will go down with the new cam? Should I have any piston to valve clearance problems with the 1.90/1.60 valves? How much time could I expect to shave off of my E.T.?

Thanks Corral
 
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#2 ·
timing events are so close of each that you could go with either, I'd vote for the Lunati as it has more lift as long as you have clearance for it....
 
#6 ·
The Lunati looks better and gives you room to utilize the extra lift if you decide to open up the induction a bit more down the road(larger t.b./intake etc.) I would be careful with the 1.7rr's with either of those cams though. You may have to go to 1.6's. Which afr cc size 58? Tom.
 
#7 ·
Hey TOM89LX50, I'm going to use 1.6 RR's. I figure I should be able to trade my pedestal mount 1.7's straight up for someone's 1.6's here on the forum. Also, my AFR's have the 60 cc chamber I believe.

Right now I'm kind of leaning towards the Anderson because on his website he says it was built to work with the stock computer. He also said that it works with stock 87-95 pistons and small valve heads without notching the pistons.

Thanks for the advice. Would anybody else like to add in? Thanks Corral
 
#8 ·
PaxNovi 5.0 said:
Hey TOM89LX50, I'm going to use 1.6 RR's. I figure I should be able to trade my pedestal mount 1.7's straight up for someone's 1.6's here on the forum. Also, my AFR's have the 60 cc chamber I believe.

Right now I'm kind of leaning towards the Anderson because on his website he says it was built to work with the stock computer. He also said that it works with stock 87-95 pistons and small valve heads without notching the pistons.

Thanks for the advice. Would anybody else like to add in? Thanks Corral

why wouldnt you get a custom cam for 50 bucks more and save the headache and get somthing you will know that works... instead of the n41"works with every combo cam"
 
#10 ·
he will say what do you have .. and when you give him the money you will get your specs.. remember you nor i are cam grinders with min exp.. this guy will make you a cam that is exactly for your combo and will do what you want it to do.. "its custom to you" and only you.. ask around ed is the best imo..
 
#11 ·
Why so much exhaust bias? Are you gonna spray or boost it? The AFR's are pretty well balanced intake/exhaust flow - I'd think something that a little more balanced on the intake and exhaust side would work better with the AFR's. Also, what are the .006" durations on both ? I'd like to have a feel for how agressive the ramps are....
 
#13 ·
I'm not sure what the .006 durations are. This does come from Anderson's site:

"AFM cams are designed to significantly increase the "rate of acceleration", a term used by cam designers to describe the speed at which the cam lobe begins to open the valve, and similar design characteristics in closing the valve as well."

Is this kind of what you're after?
 
#15 · (Edited)
I had the same thought as you before I bought my custom from Buddy Rawls. I suggest if you can't get past putting the selection of your cam specs in the hands of a professional that you're not ready to go there yet.

But I'll tell you - there's much to know about the cams that isn't listed in the data you've provided. Two cams with the same lift and .050" duration can have drastically different lobe designs and perform quite differently. The beauty of what Ed and Buddy do is their ability to model your set up - with a model that is VASTLY more complex and accurate than DeskTop dyno by the way (DD is fun to play with, but not much more useful than guessing at things) and based on the output they can predict with great accuracy whether or not, for example, it's gonna produce enough torque at 1800 rpm to meet your drivability and fuel mileage needs. If you're happy with your current drivability and fuel mileage, I've got a sneaky feeling that either of those cams may not be what you're after. But you seem to know what you want/need.....

And in case it wasn't clear - I'd only let Buddy or Ed spec a cam for me. No way I'd try to pick an off the shelf myself. I'd just be guessing. Cam choice is too critical to performance, and cam changes are too expensive and time consuming for me to just guess at them.
 
#16 ·
Thanks for the replies Michael. Can I ask what made you go with a Buddy Rawls cam instead of an Ed Curtis design?

I might have to make a couple calls to these guys. I know what I want in a cam, but I'd like to know realistically what cam or cam specs can meet my wants.
 
#17 · (Edited)
"I know what I want in a cam" Not sure what that means. When I first started this journey, I think I would've said the same thing. Now what I'd say is -- I know what I want out of my engine in terms of performance. I know I wanted a smooth 800 rpm idle. I know I wanted 20" of vacuum at idle. I know I wanted factory level or better of torque from idle til it stopped breathing. I knew I didn't want peak power any higher than 5000 rpm; I didn't want peak torque any higher than about 3800. What I didn't know was what I wanted in a cam -- because my first choice absolutely sucked. After dealing with that, I finally realized I was just guessing based on numbers like lift, duration, and what others were saying.

What convinced me to go with a custom was that I wanted certainty that when I put it in, it was gonna perform like we though it would. All of the predictions out of Buddy's model --well it couldn't have been any more accurate. Idle, vacuum, drivability, bottom end torque, fuel mileage (19 city/24-26 highway with what would be 3.90 gearing in a STang), peak torque at 3800, peak power at 4900 - perfect. And the specs weren't anything at all like what I was looking at.

Decide to go forward with them or not. Sending an email, or calling them may or may not work. As you might imagine they get hundreds of such contacts a week. Impossible for them to know who's serious and who isn't.

The best advice I can give you is IF you want certainty, just send your money and start the process. You won't be sorry you did. But you must trust the process.
 
#19 ·
Having lots of experience with AFR heads and ported stock intakes, I can tell you that those cams are very less than optimal for your application. Unless you cut open the upper and really opened it up, your going to leave alot on the table. Porting a stock lower has very limited benefit if the upper is not modified significantly. I used a stock cam and my results blow away many of those using custom cams. You have to increase inlet capability in the intake before crutching it with a custom cam (although it will help signicantly).
My advice would be to keep your stock cam and get yourself a cobra/explorer, or better yet a Edelbrock RPM or II. Porting the lower (with welded runners, preferably) on the cobra/explorer will really help out if you go that route.
If you are stuck on getting a new cam, go with an Ed Curtis designed stick. Look around the Corral and you will see that he makes the best cams around, and can deal with your limited intake capability.
 
#21 ·
The most important thing to do now is get a chassis dyno and tune to establish a baseline. Then you can evaluate what you need from there. Quarter mile times are also helpful, but other things (tires gears traction) will have an impact there.
Assuming your upper was done right, I would stay away from a cam with a huge exhaust bias. Simply stated your exhaust is pretty efficient compared to your intake. A single pattern cam or one with 2-4 more degrees on the exhaust would be best, with a narrow lsa if you keep the duration modest (say215 to 220), and a bit wider in the mid 220's. The right lsa will be critical here.
Invest the money and get a cam from Ed Curtis. He consistantly gets more from combos than anyone else (some of the so-called experts have pretty lame results).
good luck
 
#22 ·
PaxNovi 5.0 said:
That's cool, I just find it hard to buy a cam without knowing the specs beforehand. I'd like to know the specs before I pay $325, you know? It would set my mind more at ease.
I know exactly what you mean. I went through the same thought process but once you talk to these guys you will see they mean business. They have ALOT of time, $, and practical experience. Its hard to believe they would know whats better for your motor than you do but if you lay it on the line with them they can nail it. Ed ground the cam for my combo below and I picked up 4 tenths from the e cam I was using and that e.t and mph are before the dyno tune with the #'s listed below. Talk to them. They will settle your nerves and when the $'s in the mail you will feel better. Tom.
 
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