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Old 01-03-2014, 10:33 PM   #1
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Intake question/fitment issue

I found that the original Cobra Intake and the After market on Part# M-9424-Z51/-Z51P (P is for polished version) does NOT fit GT40X heads. The factory "True" Cobra does fit with no problems. Question I have is would the aftermarket upper still bolt to the real factory lower with no interference. Reason for asking is I already purchased the polished version (unknowingly about this variance in the casting) and would really like to use at least the Upper if possible as I can polish the lower at a later time. I was told it can be made to fit(the aftermarket one) with some machining ... but if I can use the upper then I wouldn't need to worry about it right away. Thanks for the input ...
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Old 01-03-2014, 10:49 PM   #2
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I know it was a rush/rookie mistake ... so I just need the facts on what it would take. Being overseas I had a hard time contacting FRP so I jumped on the deal ... Totally my fault and if need be I will eat it. Just thought others should know since in the other post we were debating over the differences as well. I guess I took one for the team on that ... but hopefully there can be some light at the end of the $$$ tunnel.
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Old 01-04-2014, 08:05 AM   #3
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So after some research I think I may be able to make it work with these gaskets: Ford Racing Intake Manifold Gaskets M-9439-A50. Anyone have any experience with this and any sealing issues using this on the POLISHED aftermarket version on GT40X heads ... Thanks
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Old 01-05-2014, 05:43 AM   #4
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Anyone currently running with the GT40X heads and the aftermarket version of the Cobra manifold. Best way to tell if it is aftermarket it will either have the Ford Racing plaque on the neck or if you bought it brand new. There are some differences on the bottom of the intake I could show if someone wants to post for me. If you are running this set up please let me know what you did to make it seal appropriately. I know gasket part#M9439A50 must be used but I have gotten so much confusing information on this ... For example AMR's Project Convertible Cobra uses the GT40X heads and what appears to be the aftermarket manifold. So I now know it can be done ... However I will be on a Boss 302 block vs. their stock block which could also be the issue. Any help or insight would be great. And yes I emailed them to see if they could advise me on this ... just no response yet. Thanks
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Old 01-05-2014, 12:05 PM   #5
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My gut tells me this is BS - but I understand your need to be sure. We'll see if they respond with good info or some hazy BS story. We've done a LOT of these Chinese lowers and never had an issue or question come back to us, but never say never....
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Old 01-05-2014, 03:50 PM   #6
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Thanks TMoss for stepping in ... I am sure there are a lot of these intakes out there.
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Old 01-06-2014, 04:02 AM   #7
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No new updates ... But I will post once I get some definite answers.
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Old 01-07-2014, 03:16 AM   #8
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No updates ... but for those following I will call FRPP Friday night to get a concise answer as to what the issues are and how they say they can if possible be corrected.
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Old 01-07-2014, 10:13 PM   #9
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AMR has responded and will be sending me the details. I will try to be a thorough as possible with the description they give me. Thank you
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Old 01-07-2014, 11:44 PM   #10
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What is the difference between 'original Cobra Intake' and 'factory "True" Cobra' ?

Is M-9424-Z51P a geniune Ford Racing Part or some 3rd party copy?

I am no expert, but I believe he tops should interchange.

Here is an old thread on the topic: Cobra intake does not fit GT-40X heads , though people's results varied.
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Old 01-08-2014, 05:00 AM   #11
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Thanks ADent for the reply ... I have a great picture of the lower manifolds and you can see the differences pretty clearly. The FRPP model is from China ... not a bad piece but it does differ. I could email you the pics if you want ... just pm me your email address since I cant seem to upload them. I just have gotten a lot of conflicting data from Ford Racing and from what I have seen ... I know some have been able to make it work ... check out mustang stampede on youtube (they even discuss the correct manifold gasket) problem I have is most seem to run them on stock 5.0 HO blocks and I will be using the Boss 302 so I am not sure if it will work as I cant find any specs on the valley area on that particular block. AMR's project 93 Cobra convertible used the GT40X heads and what appears to be the aftermarket intake and with decent results based on their power levels they achieved. I need reliability as I want to road course and have some boost later on. Plus I just think a 93 Cobra deserves a Cobra intake (even if it doesn't make as much power as a Holley, Edelbrock, or Trick Flow ... just my .02) Worst come to worst I will sell the GT40X and get some trick flows or AFRs before I swap the intake.
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Old 01-08-2014, 05:05 AM   #12
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Side note TMoss ( the man on porting manifolds) says they have worked well and hasn't had any issues ... however if the casting has changed on either the heads or the intake I could be in for an expensive piece I could not use. I want to have it ported by him but want to make sure it will work ... Figured others may be in the same boat and would share with the Forum ... plus I was a little over zealous in buying this part w/o properly reading Fords warning on the heads .. I made the same assumption that FRPP parts would bolt on with no issues ( wont do that again) Research, research, research!!!! I think most cant afford to make 500+ dollar mistakes so even if it does work out ... I still want others to know just for piece of mind. = )
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Old 01-08-2014, 10:18 AM   #13
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The issue with the X and Y heads are that the ports are slightly raised - this leads to some fairly thin margins when porting them on a Ford or FRPP lower. Below is a quickie mock up pic to demonstrate this. These two lowers are 100% stock Ford castings, the upper one's part # ends in -AA and the lower is a -BA. The Chinese lowers have runner exits like the BA part #. Look closely and you will see two permanent marker lines the size of a port positioned for most aftermarket heads (AFR,TW,Edel, etc) in the standard location and one that is slightly raised taken from an X/Y head. When we port for X & Y heads we don't go all the way to the top to avoid gasket sealing issues as should you if you do this and don't want to do a bunch or welding. If there is any issue that could crop up, it may be related to this - but we have done a lot of FRPP Cobra lowers and have not had an issue reported back to us do date - but you never know I guess.

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Old 01-08-2014, 06:25 PM   #14
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93 does the pic show your problem?
If so that ford gasket is only .010 thicker the a felpro 1250
Use a trick flow intake gasket they are .120 thick this will solve your problem.
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Old 01-08-2014, 10:22 PM   #15
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Not 100% since my block could be the variable ... I am just waiting to call FRPP this Friday to find out if that would be the case or if it is just a cylinder head issue. Thanks for the recommendation as I may purchase a few different gaskets to see what will work ... but I want to get the Port job done first ... worst come to worst I could sell here on the forum if it is a block issue (doubt it is though) Hopefully Friday FRPP will confirm and AMR will have some insight as well. Thanks everyone for the input.
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Old 01-09-2014, 06:36 AM   #16
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Tmoss ... Do you think it is possible when porting to leave a little extra "meat" at the top of the intake to give the gasket just a little more to grab on to? Say an extra 1/8"? I believe this may be the issue since they did say something about welding extra material to make it match. If that is the case do you think the recommended TF gasket above would be a good match being that it is thicker? If they say it can work ... I may order a few different gaskets to see which one offers the best fit and seal. I was also told I will have to run a spacer so will that need to be present when port matching as well? I am going to try a 3/8 first to see what I can get away with but also a 1/2". I am sure I can polish it to match the manifold so it will match (Shine polish ... not port) Thanks for all the help, patience, and guidance.
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Old 01-09-2014, 09:36 AM   #17
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we already pay attention to the margin and leave more like 3/8"-1/4" for gasket sealing there for X and Y heads. The spacers between the upper and lower typically don't need to be ported, but we do a simple gasket match on the lower which removes very little material. If the spacer is sent we will check and correct alignment if needed. Having a couple of different thickness gaskets is a good idea.
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Old 01-09-2014, 05:11 PM   #18
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Great ... Thanks for all the help and info ... As soon as I can get some clarification I will let you know. I will have to order the spacers and gaskets ... but once they come I will have the manifold shipped out to you! I am hoping for the best ... even ordered the Energy motor mounts to ensure hood clearance since I hear they are the lowest urethane mounts you can get as they seem to be similar to convertible specs. Just hope it doesn't affect pinion angle ...
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Old 01-10-2014, 08:48 AM   #19
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So here is an update for anyone following ... The TFS gasket mentioned above +Part# TFS-2893 and specs at 0.120 thick w/ 2.25 x1.40 ports. Ford Racings gasket #M9439A50 is 0.065 thick but is steel reinforced where as the Trick Flow gasket is a compressed fiber laminate ... So I am not sure on the sealing capabilities especially if heat and boost is in the mix. Not too much experience to be honest on how well gaskets hold up to boost on intakes ... I will have the FRPP information shortly. I believe they will say with appropriate port matching they can work (Making Tmoss totally correct!!) and would hopefully clear this up for any future enquiries. Fingers Crossed = ) and feeling optimistic!!
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Old 01-10-2014, 09:43 AM   #20
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Let me add for anyone, but especially for you boosted guys - I suggest re-torquing the lower at least 3 times - a week or more apart while driving daily. Heat cycles and gasket compression will loosen the torque clamping force.
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Old 01-10-2014, 09:56 AM   #21
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Just got off the phone with Ford Racing tech. They say the issue is simply not enough material around the gasket mating area. Their recommended fix is to weld a bead approx. 3/16" welded top and bottom to extend the flange out to ensure full gasket coverage.(you can actually see the gap in the gasket on the Mustang Stampede video I stated above. I think for a N/A application Tmoss is 100% correct ... they will and do work fine. In my case with boost he said it would be mandatory to have this done. I guess I just need to find a machine shop capable of this and I should be good to go as well. So I hope this answers any questions about the FRPP Cobra manifolds .. If your running N/A and moderate HP numbers go with TMoss and he can hook you up ... If you want to be boosted on an aftermarket FRPP Cobra get it welded on the gasket upper and lower edges to increase the width .. Machine it flat again ... then in my case if you can get that done ... again .. send it to TMoss for more Power = ) Thanks
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Old 01-10-2014, 01:59 PM   #22
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Thumbs up

Awesome research 93 svt! Nothing like going to the source, glad it is going to work out well
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:18 PM   #23
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Thanks 89OEM ... I feel it is important if you ask questions on a forum it is just as important to research and provide the best feedback possible for other members. I just hope it helps out anyone that had the same/similar questions as I did since so many of these intakes are out there. If I was staying N/a I wouldn't have a problem and TMoss would definitely have my intake on its way ... I just wanted other to know that w/GT40X heads there is an issue but I also wanted to find out exactly what it was. If you have regular ported head ie: GT40P, E7, ect. you should have ZERO problems ... this only pertains to high ports and particularly Boosted applications. TMoss has been great in helping me out with this too so if you ever have any intake work needing to be done he definitely would be my #1 recommendation! Thanks Everyone!!!
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Old 01-19-2014, 12:38 AM   #24
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I may be getting the actual Mic'd numbers for the surface difference between these two manifolds if my Dad has the time to do it ... I will try to post them when and if the come. Should be interesting. = ) I recently purchased the RF-F87E-9K461-BA as a stock lower based on what Ford Racing recommended. So just to make sure the differences are what they claimed I will try to post some real world numbers for everyone.
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Old 01-23-2014, 05:28 AM   #25
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Ok ... So I got the numbers from what my Dad was able to grab before sending the intake to TMoss ... It is a lot of data so if anyone is truly interested I will gladly share via PM so I can email it to them with the pics and numbers. I can say I was surprised by what I saw. There are more differences than I thought so you can pretty much say there are significant difference between the two. I cant vouch for fitment until we get everything together ... which will be sometime till I return ... I plan on doing a full build thread once the fun begins ... TMoss has been excellent and I highly recommend him for anyone wanting to do any port work on intakes.
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Old 01-23-2014, 06:29 AM   #26
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I have a lot of OEM experience w/engine sealing. The surface area doesn't matter as much as focused pressure. This is why a lot of high end gaskets will have a small bead about 2mm wide running around the port. With care you can replicate this with some high temp silicon and make this work.

And Mr Moss is correct on the re-torquing. It'll take 3-4 checkings to get them to stay after heat cycled. (same goes for head studs)
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Old 01-23-2014, 06:37 AM   #27
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Thanks for the Input ... TMoss has been great helping me out on this ... He is a wizard with the intakes ... My biggest issue was wanting to run boost in the future and Fords words of caution on the sealing. I just figured to play better safe then sorry when spending the coin for porting. I know most have used the FRPP models with luck ... I just didn't want to chance it and figured I would do some ground work for future people with questions. I will be N/A for a while so I will see how it goes from there.
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