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Old 11-03-2006, 09:37 AM   #1
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351 Cleveland Build Up

I have a 1970 Mustang Fastback (Mach 1) and recently bought a 1973 351c motor. I already built a strong C6 as well as changed the 9" gears to 3:89's. My question is...this motor is completely stock. I would like to have a strong 1/4 mile car but do not know where to stick the money. Any suggestions on what to do to this completely stock motor? Motor has 55,000 on it now. I would like to see the car get a 12 - 13 second 1/4. Part numbers from previous builds would be great if you had them.
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Old 11-03-2006, 09:39 AM   #2
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This is an original 2v, 2 barrell motor. Would like to change to 4 barrel.
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Old 11-04-2006, 07:46 AM   #3
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You just need to put some decent heads on it, pick a suitable cam and a convertor to suit.
I run 3.89 gears in my 351c, but have 2v AFD heads and F246 cam and it does 11.90. It won't be hard at all to run the numbers you are after.
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Old 11-05-2006, 05:00 AM   #4
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What will a good set of heads run dollar wise? Which would you recommend? Is it possible just to take 2v cast iron heads i have to machine shop? Recommend an intake?
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Old 11-05-2006, 05:33 PM   #5
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I'm sure XD will have some good advice for you. I think he runs a set of AFD 2V's on his motor.

Personally I think you might find you'd have to put about 12 - $1500 US in your stock 2V heads to get them set for a "solid" street build.

It's pretty well known that the stock 2 piece valves are a liability to a C. They pop heads off and or sink the valve keepers under high revs. Either case means a shattered piston and possibly a cracked block. Next are the guides, studs, guide plates, springs, retainers and all the machining to go with it. You might be encouraged to go with larger valves which adds to the pocket machine work on the heads. All in all, lot's of parts and labor.

There are several very good aftermarket heads available from CHI, AFD, and even Edelbrock here in the US. They all run about $2000 (complete) with valves, hardened seats for unleaded, springs, guide plates etc. They are aluminum heads also which saves quite a bit of weight.

In any event you will still have the added cost of cam, lifters, intake, push rods, rockers, carb etc. At least another $2000.

Is the bottom end solid? Was the rebuild just stock, cast pistons, std oil pump etc? Nothing wrong there if it is, it just means you would want to stay with a hyd cam if you aren't going to tear down to put the oil restrictors above the mains. (they limit the oil to the cam bearings and force more to the rear mains).

The intake you choose should be determined by the heads and the cam. Again, lots of very good aftermarket stuff available.

CHI makes an intake to suit there heads. Very good choice from what I hear.

XD, do you know of AFD makes one also?

If you go the Edelbrocks, the RPM AirGap would be the goods. (I haven't heard terrific results with the Edelbrocks though) Pricey and may not perform to CHI or AFD out of box.

Just MHO. You are sure to get more.

Good luck!
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Old 11-06-2006, 03:45 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClevelandRocks View Post
CHI makes an intake to suit there heads. Very good choice from what I hear.

XD, do you know of AFD makes one also?
AFD are soon to release a whole range of manifolds. I use a TFC hirise on my alloy heads and it works good.
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Old 11-06-2006, 04:43 AM   #7
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I all he wants to do is run in the 13s, or maybe the 12s, he doesn't have much work to do....

Four things I would do:

1) Lose the C6, it will rob most of the power the engine is making. A C4 will bolt right in. If you have already bought a stall for the C6, PA makes an adapter so you can use it on a C4. The adapter cost about $40.

2) Find a pair of closed chamber 4 barrel heads. Since all he wants to do is run 13s, maybe 12s, he is not going to have to worry about spinning over 5500 rpms in which case the stock valve train, save maybe for a new set of springs will be all he needs.

3) As mentioned, find a decent single plane intake and a 750 double pumper holley. An old Edelbrock Torquer would be a good intake.

4) Get someone like Buddy Rawls to recommend a decent flat tappet hydraulic cam that will build power from off idle to 5000 or 5500. A hydraulic flat tappet cam will work with the stock bolt down rockers.
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Old 11-06-2006, 09:30 AM   #8
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All your input is really helping. I don't think i can get rid of the C6 for the simple fact i have already stuck my money into it. Also, is it not worth sticking any money in the 2v heads? What stall speed is recommended? If i do find a set of 4v heads (not sure where to look yet), how much machine work is to be done to achieve?

My father discouraged me from putting 3:89's in the rear end. Do you all think its too much. I would still like to be a highway car as well.

Your input is much appreciated!
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Old 11-06-2006, 07:29 PM   #9
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The C6 is a major disadvantage. I would try to avoid using it if possible. The 3.89s are a little low of you want to drive it on the street a lot. Forget any practical interstate cruising unless you put at least a 28" tall tire on the rear. The 3.89s would be fine if yo had an overdrive transmission.

Using a C4 transmission, 3.25 rear gears, and say around a 25-26" tall tire you could achieve your goal of 13s or 12s with the regular 2 barrel heads. I recommended the 4 barrel close chamber heads because it would be a little easier to achieve the goal. I don't know what your really looking for as far as streetability or driveability. My personal choice is that if it is going to be a street car, it needs to sound like a street car. Meaning, perfectly smooth idle. With the lower compression of the open chamber 2 barrel heads, almost any cam you choose is going to have at least a little lope to it. Not that its a bad thing, or that it could affect streetability, it's just some people want a perfectly smooth idle for a street car. Best to check with someone like Buddy Rawls, or Jay Allen and they could tell you more.
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Old 11-07-2006, 02:55 PM   #10
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How much money do you want to spend ?

check this place for heads . http://www.ausfordparts.com/ .

also as stated I would ditch the c6 and go with a c4. If wanting to go with the cast iron 4v heads. Check Mustang Corral out in Edwardsville, I think I seen you were from Illinois. They had a bunch of 4v heads last I was in there about 3 weeks ago. They had open and closed chambered I believe. Dont remember the prices though.
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Old 11-11-2006, 06:06 AM   #11
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I'd buy a set of 70-71 4v Closed Chamber heads. Then get you a decent intake manifold. A good .600 lift cam and some headers. Then it'll make some power. 351C heads flow a lot for stock heads but they need a lot of lift as well. If you look at flow charts of the heads they really gain a lot of flow from .500 to .600. 351C's 4v's with CC heads are awesome i wish i had a 100 of them.
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Old 11-12-2006, 09:44 PM   #12
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Thanks for all your help thus far...I will follow up in about 1-2 months and let you know what i ended up with. Appreciate you all.
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Old 11-13-2006, 01:37 PM   #13
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First off - - don't worry about the C6. They are bulletproof, and it will not cost you more than a tenth or two in the 1/4 maximum. Probably less than that.

Next - get a good set of heads. Closed chamber 4Vs with good prep and a Blue Thunder intake, coupled with a decent cam, and you're most of the way home.

The bottom end does need to be in very good shape - but it has modest mileage and is likely just fine. I would not want to buzz it too awful hard with the cast pistons though....

The 3.89 gears are fine - maybe a little tall for highway cruising - but fine none the less.

We did a 351C 2bbl motor up several years ago in a '73 Mach 1. Added prepped 4V heads, a inexpensive hydraulic flat tappet cam, headers, and a swap meet Offy intake that cleared the Ram Air hood. Car went 13.70 with a 3.25 gear a stock converter, and an FMX trans. You'll go faster...
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Old 11-23-2006, 02:47 AM   #14
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Call Crane or Comp Cams and have them grind this hydraulic camshaft for you......

.524" intake lift / .554" exhaust lift
224 degrees intake / 236 degrees exhaust duration at .050" lift
110 degree lobe sep angle with the intake ground on a 106 centerline

Add 4V heads, Torker intake, decent 750 cfm carb, 1 7/8" headers and you're in business. Just keep the C6 and the 3.89 gears. You'll have fun.
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